on demand water heater install

Teutone

don't know if this is the right section to post this.

I am thinking of replacing the truma boiler with a tank less on demand hot water heater.

anybody fitted one?
 

Old_Arthur

i have also thought of going down this path?? do they do a model that has a self contained igniter (by that i mean not coupled to mains power like in statics ect?)
 

Byronic

For a motor home and for what it's worth I reckon an on demand/instantaneous water heater is a better alternative than the storage alternative.
I only use the present storage heater for showers, much more sensible to heat water in a kettle for everything else. Only downside of note for the on demand type is that there is of course no electric immersion element so if you go to campsites and pay for electricity then you miss out.
I used to have an instantaneous in a previous van, Valliant model I think. Easy to fit but I can imagine it could be difficult to find a good position for it in some vans, eg you want to get it as near to where the hot water is needed the most..... usually the kithen tap, also the flue position can be a prob. I seem to recall that some of the caravan specific heater in the distant past didn't even need a flue.
 
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vwalan

hi. fitted loads .use them all the time in the truck conversions. i dont bother with a flue ,but really only use it for the shower. dont fit the heater in the shower room though. i have a morcoin mine that one needs a pilot light .but now i import ones that dont they use a battery and ignite on turning on of the tap .or shower. great bits of kit . never understood how they fell out of favour. i boil a kettle for small quantities ie. washing pots etc.
easy to fit cold in hot out .plus a gas feed . dont use mixer tap in shower set it at the heater. makes life simple .use a surflo pump on the water in line.
couldnt be simpler .
bit like catalitic heaters and gas lights ,all excellent.
 
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n brown

n brown

Forum Member
Old_Arthur said:
?? what powers the ignition
Click to expand...

some use a battery,but some use water power,the water running spins a turbine spark generator.this modern stuff eh? like alan i never had a flue,just opened the hatch but of course can't advise that now.i don't really know how we survived really,no gas drop holes,no flues,red hot woodburners,no breakdown no papers no idea no worries
 

Lorry Ball

I've been thinking of fitting one as well

found this on ebay Item number: 170767331516
under £100 seems a good deal.....


Lorry :drive:
 

Byronic

vwalan said:
hi. fitted loads .use them all the time in the truck conversions. i dont bother with a flue ,but really only use it for the shower. .
Click to expand...

So that could be anything up to twice a year then Alan?

Thing is that if you don't flue the thing and it comes supplied with flue and it instructs you to install the flue then:
A) you would be stupid not to.... ie carbon monoxide reasons
B) if you have a fire the insurer is unlikely to pay out assuming you have at least fire and theft
.
OK in the good old days if it didn't come with a flue and didn't advise to fit one.
 

Teutone

wow, didn't expect such a response just in a few hours after posting.

We have a CI Motorhome with bunk beds across the rear. Cramming six people in a Motorhome of that size is a joke anyway, so the plan is to convert it into a spacious two person MH which can sleep 4 if required.

The bottom bunk bed will be the garage, there are two doors in the sides already and the upper bunk bed will provide more storage. The shower's backwall is part if the bunk bed / garge and I am planning to fit the water heater there and flue through the roof. Removing the truma boiler will free up space for a large leisure battery (solar charged) and maybe another water tank. ( I do like my showers...)

I am not worried about the loss of the electric heater element, I am going to fit a refillable LPG bottle and want to run the fridge on gas anyway. Want to stay as independent as possible.

Not sure if I am going to fit a cheap no name heater from ebay or invest a little bit more and buy a known brand with the security of spare parts availability.
Any recomendations? Rinnai? Morco?

thanks for all your input.
 
n brown

n brown

Forum Member
don't know the modern ones, but used to find rinnai easier to regulate,i expect they're all good now
 

vwalan

hi morco ones are made in spain anyway.very common over there cant remember the spanish name but they are sold every where over there.
the ones i bring in dont come with a flue and in the instructions give what size ventilation to have open depending on the size or room its in. they are either japanese or from china.
very similar to the ones on ebay but no temp gauge.
byronic i have a shower once a year whether i need it or not , never mind the cost.
one things for sure dont shower outside in uk in winter .
fagor thats who used to make morco.
 
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Byronic

vwalan said:
hi morco ones are made in spain anyway.very common over there cant remember the spanish name but they are sold every where over there.
the ones i bring in dont come with a flue and in the instructions give what size ventilation to have open depending on the size or room its in
Click to expand...

Fagor, made in northern Spain, Vitoria I think.
If memory serves well then... on demand heaters of ye good olde days were generally of 2 main types; domestic and lesser throughput types specifically designed for caravans ie small spaces, so could be used without a flue.The domestic size appliances I think always needed to be flued.
Small Ascots (remember them?) Also could be used without flue in kitchens, presumably not considered likely to be used for more than a few minutes at a time.
I would imagine that gas regs would not allow this these days.
Do you think those Moroccan instructions would be considered compatible with British Standards?
That Artic freeze is hitting us down on the Costa del Sol @ the moment, if it was warmer I'd be @ a tapas bar instead of typing "interesting replies". I expect no sympathy from you knowing I won't get any but I saw your weather complaints on another site.
 
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n brown

n brown

Forum Member
i used to wonder a bit about no flue,but when you see the flames in the water heater and compare it with the 4 burners going on the cooker,not a lot in it and you don't think to flue a cooker. being aware and using common sense, i at least opened a hatch or window
 
maingate

maingate

Forum Member
An interesting thread and a bit spooky as I often wonder why they are not widely used in homes as well. If I could fit one at home, in the kitchen, I would and might do it when we do a revamp. My main reason is economy. About 5 years ago, we had a very dry summer and as a water saving measure, I collected water in a bucket (for my Roses and Hydrangeas)when I ran the hot tap. The bucket was 3/4 full before the hot water arrived. That means that I have 3/4 of a bucket of hot water in the pipework that just cools off after using expensive gas to heat it. The cost savings over a year must be significant.

When I was planning a self build a few years ago, my plan was to fit 2 of these. As has been said, one in the kitchen area and one for the shower. That is a good tip from Alan about setting the thermostat to the shower temperature rather than fiddling with the mixer tap.

The layout of my van is OK as regards the hot water apart from one big snag. If I want the heating ticking over on gas overnight, the hot water has to be on as well. The noise of it igniting regularly is annoying as well as wasteful of gas.
 

Byronic

n brown said:
i used to wonder a bit about no flue,but when you see the flames in the water heater and compare it with the 4 burners going on the cooker,not a lot in it and you don't think to flue a cooker. being aware and using common sense, i at least opened a hatch or window
Click to expand...

The way I believe those that set the standards see it, is that these water heaters are used often in situations where say the shower is remote from the heater and the shower user may well forget to open say a window in the room the heater is operating, which may easily contain someone for example sleeping and therefore unsuspecting. Whereas the cooker generally has someone in attendance who hopefully if using 4 burners and the oven will open a window before or during use, or if they don't at least before they pass out.
Anyway this seems like a damn good reason to flue.
 

vwalan

hi yes the water heaters are all to iso9001/2000. i checked with the chinese manufacturer about importing direct to uk . its possible .but if i order 1000 i can get free shipping. as i didnt want that many i get them from the moroccan importer. in less quantities . they are sold all over the world ,usa takes lots and you can see them on ebay in the states . they come with full english instructions and french of course. they can be fitted in the bathroom but i dont like that idea . morco/fagor do big versions but i have used the smaller camper style for showers at home . work a treat.
and yes using the controls on the heater saves extra pipework in the vans .makes sense really. they are still used in houses, but again with combi boilers getting cheaper houses usually dont bother any more.
for van heating you cant beat thermexcatalitic heaters .they have stopped making them now .but still make a blue flame heater with co,co2 cut outs . we use them in the bigger truck conversions . thermex are also spanish up near santander at noain in navarra . i pick them up at the factory as well.
i hope that answers your question byronic .hee he.
by the way its just gone below freezing here now . got to 5-6c in the day .lovely. think what you are missing .ha ha .
 
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