Upgrading tyres

[MarkJ]

The base van I want to buy (Relay/Boxer) comes with 215/70 R15 109 tyres. I think these might be marginal on load if my build ends up with us running on the weight limit, so I was looking at how to upgrade them. They offer an option to upgrade to 225/70R15 112 tyres, but on the price list you have to buy the expensive air suspension too.

Any reason I couldn’t just swap them myself?

I think the 225s are 2% bigger circumference but that’s not a big speedo error. And I presume that’s what happens with the factory option anyway.

Anyone see any issues with just putting 225s on?

 

[Nabsim]

I run conti four seasons 225/70/R15 on my Sprinter and they are rated higher than you need (115) but if you need any real measurements just shout

 

[Millie Master]

I think these might be marginal on load if my build ends up with us running on the weight limit.

Mark that is exactly why from day one of my build I concentrated on making my conversion as light weight as possible and it isn't a hard thing to do if you have the committed mind set to do so, it also proved to be quite a low cost build and has proven to be exceptionally hard wearing.

With regards to the tyres and suspension, well the OE specifications will allow for a commercial van running at close to or indeed slightly over the maximum weight limit so in all honestly, I wouldn't worry about it too much, but if you do decide to go up a single tyre size then as they will have a more compliant side wall then just as long as your suspension is in a good serviceable condition there shouldn't be any need to upgrade the system......
BUT before you do upgrade the tyre specification make certain that doing so is covered by the OE specifications as detailed by the van manufacturer as if it doesn't then you legally have to inform your insurance company about the modification and if at any time in the future (god forbid) your van was involved in a fatality RTA, then I can assure you, every single aspect of your vehicle would be thoroughly checked by both the boys in blue as well as the technical men of the DVSA.

 

[Nabsim]

I thought I would have to go to 16” rims to get a tyre that would take the loading. Was always easy with cars but I struggled to find anything for the van. There were plenty of 5 stud van Ali wheels for under a grand but they weren’t rated for the axle loading I have (rear that the biggie).
If there are models of your van with same fitting but a size up you may be able to go that way. Not done it with the van but on cars as an example if you fitted a bigger ford wheels that was an option from new to a ford you were fine.
Likewise was there an option in your van range for 225 tyres? Make sure your rims will take a 225 as well, should easily do this if 215 is standard.
If you had a 5 stud sprinter you could have tried my spare

 

[MarkJ]

I concentrated on making my conversion as light weight as possible

yes, I’m very conscious about weight. Were there any major things you did differently when you thought about the weight? For example, I have two space/water heating solutions in mind and if I suspect one will be noticeably heavier than the other. And weights of batteries seem to vary hugely too.

 

[MarkJ]

was there an option in your van range for 225 tyres

Yes, but weirdly you have to have a different suspension option with it. I don’t think there’s any tech reason, I suspect it’s marketing, but wondered if anyone knew otherwise

 

[Nabsim]

Yes, but weirdly you have to have a different suspension option with it. I don’t think there’s any tech reason, I suspect it’s marketing, but wondered if anyone knew otherwise

Is it same weight with the different suspension or is it to up plate the axle weights? That’s the normal reason for updating tyres and suspension I think

 

[MarkJ]

Is it same weight with the different suspension or is it to up plate the axle weights?

Same weight with different suspension. The rear axle is rated at 2,000kg and the standard tyres give you 2,060kg, so there’s not a lot of leeway. The air suspension is possibly aimed at people who have heavy loads day in, day out...bit like a camper! But I don’t want the complexity of the air suspension- but I’d take the uprated tyres.

 

[Millie Master]

yes, I’m very conscious about weight. Were there any major things you did differently when you thought about the weight? For example, I have two space/water heating solutions in mind and if I suspect one will be noticeably heavier than the other. And weights of batteries seem to vary hugely too.

Mark, my construction technique was where I believed I saved a lot of weight, it has also proved to be amazingly strong.

I used 25 x 50 mm roofing laths throughout the construction (fully dried and arrow straight), they are very cheap to buy as well as being both strong and light just as long as you avoid any and all lengths with large knots.
With these I made a thorough perimeter frame work construction using most lap joints.
Wherever I wanted the resulting panel to be exceptionally strong, such as the walls of the shower/loo area, I faced the frame on one side with normal 4mm ply and then sandwich glued a 25mm thickness of Cellotex inside the frame before then facing the outside with either 4 mm oak faced ply or for the internal walls of the shower room with Morlands vinyl faced ply.

My batteries are both gel, the room heater is a very lightweight and efficient Propex which I bought via Gumtree, unused, still boxed and yet for only £50 and the water heater is a 'Henry' which I found on ebay, yet again unused and still boxed for under £100.

The refillable gas cylinder I went for is a glassfibre SafeFill which is a fraction of the weight of a steel Calor or similar of an equal size

However else I can help you, don't hesitate to ask.

Phil

 

[MarkJ]

However else I can help you, don't hesitate to ask

Brilliant. Thanks, I will.

I discovered recently that my local builders merchant has a big pile of roofing lath offcuts and broken bits which are less than half price: a 2m bit is no good for a roofer but handy for a van... I got about 10m in bits for about £2!

 

[Millie Master]

And Mark, as if and when you get around to fitting any roof lights and the problems that you will have with the ridges in the roof, pop along to your local double glazing installation company and there you will find a scrap pile of trim pieces that they use when fitting the windows........... I bet a pound to a penny that you will find loads of pieces that will very nearly match the depth of these ridges making the fitting of the roof lights so very much easier.
In my case when I went to my local window Co. I could have taken tons of the stuff for no charge whatsoever!

Oh and another use I found for this plastic trim was to finish off in the shower room around the sink and the loo, it worked brilliantly!!

Phil

 

[Debs]

The base van I want to buy (Relay/Boxer) comes with 215/70 R15 109 tyres. I think these might be marginal on load if my build ends up with us running on the weight limit, so I was looking at how to upgrade them. They offer an option to upgrade to 225/70R15 112 tyres, but on the price list you have to buy the expensive air suspension too.

Any reason I couldn’t just swap them myself?

I think the 225s are 2% bigger circumference but that’s not a big speedo error. And I presume that’s what happens with the factory option anyway.

Anyone see any issues with just putting 225s on?

I have just bought my next project, a Citroen Relay, and I specifically wanted 16" wheels, so I could get my new Goodrich all terrain tyres swapped over. New rims from Oponeo were £80 each, ouch! My relay now has the Goodrich's on and they are 225/75/16. No clearance issues. At some point I will have a decent run on the motorway and check the speed against my sat nav. From my own perspective, I always thought that 15" wheels on the Sevel vans didn't quite look right and much preferred the 16" rims.

 

[Millie Master]

From my own perspective, I always thought that 15" wheels on the Sevel vans didn't quite look right and much preferred the 16" rims.

I am afraid but it doesn't matter what they look like, are 16" rims listed as an OE fitment for the Sevel vans?

If they aren't then this in legal terms is a modification and your insurance company must be notified and if, just if you were either pulled by the DVSA or worst still were involved in a serious RTA then I am afraid it doesn't matter two hoots if they look better, if they aren't OE then get ready for the proverbial book being thrown at you.

Sorry

Phil

 

[Squiffy]

Yes Phil, Sevel Van's especially xlwb versions are designated 16" wheels, I've always thought 15" wheels looked too small on Sevels, seeing as they are all coming out of the same factory I suppose there must be a reason for 15" wheels to be fitted on some models could be financially ordained or could possibly on the short or mid based vehicles the suspension does not hold the chassis up high enough to clear the wheel arches Phil.

 

[Squiffy]

Actually just found this on a motorhome chat, whether it's true or not I can't say as both Ducatos that I've owned have both had 16" wheels.

"16" after market wheels would need to have lower profile tyres to keep the same overall circumference. 15" and 16' standard fiat wheels have different stud patterns and are not interchangeable."


Pps.On the other hand I've also found this

"@Lenny HB and @chaser Sorry guys, you are wrong. Fiats 15" wheels have a pcd of 5x118. Although early 16" Fiat wheels do have a 5x130 pcd, most after 2013 have the same 5x118 as the 15-inchers do. Therefore, its a straight swap.

Havng said that, its also a pointless swap, as there are no tangible benefits. Depending on the tyres used it could (stressing the word could) also be illegal. Therefore, insurance could be invalidated. There is a loophole, but its expensive."

Makes ya choice

Phil.

 

[Millie Master]

Actually just found this on a motorhome chat, whether it's true or not I can't say as both Ducatos that I've owned have both had 16" wheels.

"16" after market wheels would need to have lower profile tyres to keep the same overall circumference. 15" and 16' standard fiat wheels have different stud patterns and are not interchangeable."

Phil.

I find that very hard to believe Phil with regards to the stud patterns, it simply doesn't make economic sense for Fiat to do so?
Phil

 

[Nabsim]

All I ever had to do when modding cars was inform the insurance company. If you are fitting a wheel size the manufacturer doesn’t offer it may be different I don’t know. Of course whatever you fit has to be capable of taking axle weights, I found a lot of 3rd party aftermarket alloy wheels didn't for my van

 

[MarkJ]

I think, based on what I've read, that the 16" wheels are fitted to 'heavy' or 'maxi' versions. The wheel hubs are bigger and stronger to cope with the extra weight. On 15" rims the maximum tyre loading rating you can conveniently find is 109, which corresponds to 2,060kg on the rear axle against the max axle weight of 2,000kg - i.e. on the limit. So for the heavy, they fit bigger hubs and bigger wheels which allows you tyres of a higher load rating as well.

So, OE might well be 16" for some vans, but I'm not sure of the legal position of fitting them to the version that wasn't meant to have them.

 

[Debs]

I am afraid but it doesn't matter what they look like, are 16" rims listed as an OE fitment for the Sevel vans?

If they aren't then this in legal terms is a modification and your insurance company must be notified and if, just if you were either pulled by the DVSA or worst still were involved in a serious RTA then I am afraid it doesn't matter two hoots if they look better, if they aren't OE then get ready for the proverbial book being thrown at you.

Sorry

Phil

Nicely answered by Squiffy.

 

[Debs]

My 16" rims are factory fit, it being the XLWB, but changing rims for looks needs careful consideration and research. For myself I am not overly keen on Alloys and much prefer Steel wheels.