Help Wiring?

daisymini

Im being cheeky but is there anyone out there that can help me with the wiring? Some of the 12v wiring is already done but i need to instal Ehu and run some more wiring to 12v sockets etc I havent a clue what im doing. I cant progress any further with the refurb unless the wiring is done first, i think? Im prepared to travel as I have got a bed and a loo but thats about it at the mo...:) Ive tried googling to understand the electrical system but its all a bit beyond me?? Do i continue with the refurb ie covering walls fitting units before electrics?
Im at a standstill dont know which way to go next, any help and advice will be greatly appreciated. :confused:
 
oldish hippy

oldish hippy

Forum Member
IMPORTANT DO CHECK WHERE YOU PUT THE WIRES AND THAT YOU DO NOT PUT A FIXING THROUGH THE CABLES if in doubt then take photos with a tape measurre lying along side it so you have some idea of where the cables are

I would put the wiring in first before fixing panels then do the panels and then put in sockets afterwards and try to keep the 240 away from the water supplys just in case of leak
 

carol

Hi Sue just looked at Vernon's vid and I know it's me but I still wouldn't know where to start! I'd take Bushtrekker's advice - you need to be safe. Get cooking those cakes and meat pies and they'll be hammering on your door to help!
 
Martin P

Martin P

Forum Member
And you do have a clear plan of the basic layout dont you Sue
Slight adjustments can usually be made but a big change around can really throw a spanner in the works

So

You should have an idea where your 12v distribution point is going to be -you may already have a fuse board/breaker panel fitted which was/is used for the internal ambulance 12dc

Are you fitting a 240v battery charger or a specialised motorhome type charging /splitting/distribution unit. if so where can this be located,can it be close to the 12v distribution keeping all the electrical kit together-is there room for domestic battery how many batteries

Where is external hookup point going

MARK ALL THIS ON A SIMPLE LAYOUT PLAN stick about 6 bits of printer paper together and make the scale so its as big as possible

12vdc

Fridge
water pump
loo
heater
tv
12v sockets


Lights and switches
MARK ON PLAN

240
Fridge
tv socket
other sockets
MARK ON PLAN

Now then
Its not always necessary or desirable to run wiring behind vehicle linings but you obviously dont want it on show either
Armed with your plan you can start to work out how to run your wiring to each and every item
Just to complicate things a little further you have some maths to do
Because amps =watts divided by volts and 12 (volts) is a low number the amperage is high which in practice we need thicker cables than we might imagine
So we need to find the energy requirements of all the kit we are running wires to
I know this sounds boring but consider this
Your 2000 watt hairdryer at home on 240v =2000/240=8.3 amps
Your 200 watt hardly works 12v hairdryer 200/12= 16.6 amps
So we need to know the current consumption for each application
Then we have something called voltage drop
This means that for long cable runs we have to increase the thickness of cables
Here is a really easy to read explanation and all the formulas and charts

ME03

But we are going to cheat a bit here cos when you post all the current requirements of all your kit 10 people are going to do the maths for you
more shortly
 
Martin P

Martin P

Forum Member
For your 240v ring main I would use 2.5mm arctic cable twin and earth

Now then
grasping your plan you know exactly where every thing is going

It may be that the side door is going to prevent a full cable run on that side so it might be easier to run all your cables down the other side if you can cross to the other side of the van at some point probably over the rear doors.
Either way you have to choose a route for each side of the van
Now get a rough length for a cable run to each piece of kit
its much easier to fit sockets and switches into the sides of cupboards as this allows for easier access to cables and later wiring

It should be possible for you to install all the wiring and just leave the tails hanging out for someone to help you connect at the end
DONT forget to label all the ends

Think thats enough for now

Mart
 

daisymini

Thanks Martinp there is a lot of useful advice there..!! Im going to bite the bullet and have a go myself..:dance:

Heres the pics of the inside of the van Flyby..!!View attachment 9354View attachment 9355View attachment 9356View attachment 9357

The pic with the webasto heater in is where the kitchen is going to be, Can i site my gas bottle in the corner near the heater? also it will be next to the hob, sink in the middle and fridge at the end near the seating. Would this be safe or shall I site somewhere else>? The black box on the far wall near the little door is a panel Roger put in for all the electrics.
 
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oldish hippy

oldish hippy

Forum Member
daisy can we have close up of the panel down the far end and if possibble a picture of the back of it please as that wuil give us some idea of what you have there do you have any thing out side the van on the body work like a round plug i see you still got bambi i would layit out like the bambi with the fridge and sink by the back door as you can get out through the cab
 
n brown

n brown

Forum Member
you can pretty much have anything where you want,gas bottle next to webasto is no problem.as for the wiring,you have enough top and bottom cuboards to conceal any wiring,and you can cross the van through the locker over the cab.i do all my wiring in 2.5mm conduit cable and use appropiate fuses,got a 50m roll of brown and blue from screwfix.the 240v hookup is best put on the drivers side so you see it before you drive off
 
oldish hippy

oldish hippy

Forum Member
just thought of siting gas bottle dont forget that you will have to drill through the floor to put in a dropout vent so think about where it will come out underneath {dropvent best descriptoin bit like a sink plughole to clear the gas in event of a leak as gas is heavy than air} and do you have more than one light as seen in pictures if so you might be able to pull the cables through the same way as the lighting cables
 

MORGANTHEMOON

cornishlad said:
See here :Solar Panel Information | SolarPanelWiringDiagrams | CablesAndFuses
Fridges on 12v vary a lot in what current they draw. Older absorption fridges are less efficient than the more expensive compressor ones. My old Electrolux one takes about 8 amps. If you look at the table you can see that for a 7.5 amp draw over 5 metres, 2.5 mm cable is ok.
Click to expand...

I agree 2.5mm twin and earth should be adequate.

I must say though Sue you should not be attempting the 240 volt wiring yourself this is a qualified electricians job and you really need to know what you are doing.
 

cornishlad

Martin P said:
What 240 and 12 systems exist inside the van now, can you post a picture
Click to expand...

Sue's van has a 12v distribution panel fed from the battery box via 50amp cut out.
At the panel it is fed to 12 fuse holders of which only one is used at present (Saloon LED lights 3 amp). The other 11 spares can have circuits added by pushing spade connectors on at the back. Suitable size cable and and a appropriate blade fuse need choosing
There are another 6 fuse holders of which 4 are used for side, stop and left/right indicators located over the rear doors.
There are positions for 8 standard 30 amp relays alongside the fuses of which 4 are used for the road lights mentioned above.
A 5th relay is energised when the ignition is on and feeds 12v from the leisure battery to the two spare fuse holders below those 4 in the road light circuits. 3 relay positions are spare.

There are 4 distribution terminal posts at the back of the panel for : 12v from the leisure battery (via 50amp cutout), 12v from the VEHICLE battery when ignition is ON (fused at 15amp on the Mercedes fuse panel), 12v from the LEISURE battery when the ignition is ON and the last is vehicle ground (grounded in the leisure battery box and on the chassis at the rear)
Ther is no 240v wiring installed.
Hope this helps.
 
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cornishlad

MORGANTHEMOON said:
I agree 2.5mm twin and earth should be adequate.

I must say though Sue you should not be attempting the 240 volt wiring yourself this is a qualified electricians job and you really need to know what you are doing.
Click to expand...

Not meaning to be picky but reference to "Twin & Earth" needs some clarification. "Twin & earth" usually means the flat white cable normally used in buildings. The conductors will be Brown, Blue and a lighter gauge uninsulated earth. The conductors are INFLEXIBLE, single strand and there is no place for this type of wire in a van either in the 240 or the 12v circuits of a vehicle. Also there is no need to run an earth wire to a 12v device. All wiring should be done with flexible multi-strand cable.
12v wiring will require a 12v feed and a ground return wire to every appliance so it is most conveniently done in flexible flat twin. Flat twin may or may not have a outer sheath. A sheath does gives extra security against chaffing etc. but it's not essential if the wiring is done neatly and bound, where possible, into a loom or laid in a conduit. Searching on Ebay for "auto cable" will illustrate the big choice of multi strand cable available for vehicle wiring. (Some of these ads thou do claim higher current capacity than the table I gave in a previous post and should be taken with a pinch of salt...)
Concerning the mains wiring. If you plan on having the standard 16a blue plug input socket with 2.5m flexible cable from the EH post then use the same type of wire for all the internal mains wiring as this will be more than adequate for any normal mains appliance you plan on using. But, of course, like others have said you ned to know exactly what you're doing.
Some useful info: http://www.thomson-caravans.co.uk/advice/diyprojects/pdf/mainsinstall.pdf

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/7.9.2.htm
 

Irritable Owl

Gas bottle

Having built my own camper I offer these words of advise. Try to mount your bottle so that it is accessible from the outside, in a locker that is sealed from the rest of the camper. As the gas is heavier than sir and will sink try to have a vent at the bottom. I also installed a gas detector in my bottle storage. If it has to be inside the van then make sure you have a gas detector that will detect both carbon monoxide and propane/butane.. They are Vailable on eBay.
If you get stuck with the wiring and fancy a trip down to Suffolk then I am on holiday from the 10th nov for a week and will give you a hand woth it.
 
n brown

n brown

Forum Member
cornishlad said:
Not meaning to be picky but reference to "Twin & Earth" needs some clarification. "Twin & earth" usually means the flat white cable normally used in buildings. The conductors will be Brown, Blue and a lighter gauge uninsulated earth. The conductors are INFLEXIBLE, single strand and there is no place for this type of wire in a van either in the 240 or the 12v circuits of a vehicle. Also there is no need to run an earth wire to a 12v device. All wiring should be done with flexible multi-strand cable.
12v wiring will require a 12v feed and a ground return wire to every appliance so it is most conveniently done in flexible flat twin. Flat twin may or may not have a outer sheath. A sheath does gives extra security against chaffing etc. but it's not essential if the wiring is done neatly and bound, where possible, into a loom or laid in a conduit. Searching on Ebay for "auto cable" will illustrate the big choice of multi strand cable available for vehicle wiring. (Some of these ads thou do claim higher current capacity than the table I gave in a previous post and should be taken with a pinch of salt...)
Concerning the mains wiring. If you plan on having the standard 16a blue plug input socket with 2.5m flexible cable from the EH post then use the same type of wire for all the internal mains wiring as this will be more than adequate for any normal mains appliance you plan on using. But, of course, like others have said you ned to know exactly what you're doing.
Some useful info: http://www.thomson-caravans.co.uk/advice/diyprojects/pdf/mainsinstall.pdfwhy i use conduit wiring-its multistrand

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/7.9.2.htm
Click to expand...
the reason i use conduit cable -its mutistrand
 
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