Do you carry a scooter or motorbike in your garage?

[wildebus]

I did ask if they were required to see your V5 or if they looked it up. The response was that they have a list of minimum requirements, and if this list is met it will be tested "as presented" Hence our Plaxton Cheetah Coach has a Class 4 Motorhome MOT certificate.
Apparently all Motorhomes are Class 4 regardless of weight, I haven't checked but if your plus 7.5tonnes this can't be true?

Yup. effectively any weight (there is actually a maximum weight a Motor Caravan can legally be in the UK - something like 24 tonnes or something from memory)
And the MOT Tester does not look at or look up the V5C data. They don't access the DVLA recorded data in any way.

 

[Phantom]

For the MOT we always remove our scooter from the moho garage just to avoid any potential hassle. But guess that an MOT tester would never look in there or even weigh the back axle?
It all sounds a bit desperate if their argument is that you are carrying goods in what they have classed as a private goods vehicle! It's all gone quiet so guess it was maybe a non-issue really? But agree that the vague definitions would not stand up. A great topic well worth standing up for.

 

[Millie Master]

The one major matter of critical safety is the load bearing snap break/strength of any straps that are securing any garage mounted motorbike or scooter in place as well as of course the tie down points that of course MUST be attached to the chassis when talking about coachbuilt motorhomes and suitably load bearing points when discussing a PVC.

Over the years I have seen some ludicrously weak, madly dangerous tie down installations using things like weak/cheap bungi straps attached to hooks that have just been screwed into a piece of wood!

Phil

 

[wildebus]

The one major matter of critical safety is the load bearing snap break/strength of any straps that are securing any garage mounted motorbike or scooter in place as well as of course the tie down points that of course MUST be attached to the chassis when talking about coachbuilt motorhomes and suitably load bearing points when discussing a PVC.

Over the years I have seen some ludicrously weak, madly dangerous tie down installations using things like weak/cheap bungi straps attached to hooks that have just been screwed into a piece of wood!

Phil

I was crawling around underneath my motorhome yesterday afternoon and I was struck by the difference in appearance of the metal chassis parts that was original and the metalwork such as the various straps and clips and what have you that get added for the various pipework, cable hangers, etc either for the vehicle or as part of the motorhome side of the construction.
I don't think any of those parts get any kind of rust prevention treatment! (and it is not just Fiat or Autotrail which are like this. it is industry standard across all commercial vehicles whether used as originally intended, as a base for a Motorhome or converted as a PVC.)


Anyways, as this is motorhomeBUILDER, someone may come across this thread when looking for ways to add tie-down points, so something which can work very well and is very flexible is the UNWIN rail system, very commonly used for minibus and wheelchair seating but more uses than just that!
Example and a supplier of the rail - https://www.johnadamssupplies.co.uk/shop/unwin-rail/unwin-surface-rail/
This can be fitted to the floor or to the sides, and you can get accessories such as cargo rings to position anywhere in the rail, so put them right where you need them!
I use this system in my Camper to secure the water carriers in place but it is available in the whole length of the "garage" under the bed to tie anything down.

 

[Millie Master]

I was crawling around underneath my motorhome yesterday afternoon and I was struck by the difference in appearance of the metal chassis parts that was original and the metalwork such as the various straps and clips and what have you that get added for the various pipework, cable hangers, etc either for the vehicle or as part of the motorhome side of the construction.
I don't think any of those parts get any kind of rust prevention treatment! (and it is not just Fiat or Autotrail which are like this. it is industry standard across all commercial vehicles whether used as originally intended, as a base for a Motorhome or converted as a PVC.)

Yes Dave, in my site owning past when helping visitors out with mechanical problems I have ventured underneath flexi vans from manufacturers as diverse in sale price as Concorde, Hymer and Swift and despite some of these costing upwards of £400k I am afraid to say that in the vast majority of cases the standards and quaity of materials used when away from the normal lines of sight are honestly very low rent!!

Surely it wouldn't be expecting too much when considering those vans with large rear garages that the manufacturer would fit as OE a series of heavy duty tie down points?

Phil

 

[trevskoda]

Pity they dont galvo the chassis and use stainless bolts and fitting, fact is they dont want things to last.

 

[wildebus]

Pity they dont galvo the chassis and use stainless bolts and fitting, fact is they dont want things to last.

The under-chassis's on Vans seem a lot lot better than they used to. My 2003 VW LT and 2008 Fiat Ducato both look very solid still. It's the bodywork that tends tp be the let down.

 

[SquirrellCook]

Pity they dont galvo the chassis and use stainless bolts and fitting, fact is they dont want things to last.

Stainless against steel is a big mistake. The stainless has a galvanic reaction with the steel if it gets wet or damp. I was horrified when cutting into my plaxton cheetah. The stainless was fine, but the steel touching it crumbled in my hand.

 

[Millie Master]

Pity they dont galvo the chassis and use stainless bolts and fitting, fact is they dont want things to last.

I believe that the cab unit on Dave's Fiat MoHo will be attached to an ALKO fully galvanised extension chassis, the problem is then with regards to anything that is attached to it and if it is metal then that is very likely to be some kind of low grade mild steel.

Oh so sadly it is the very same with all the panel vans made at either the Sevel factory or the Renault factory. As we all know these bodies are fully dip galvanised but then anything that is attached to them such as exhaus hangers, spring hangers, you name it, from what I have seen that isn't part of the unitary construction of the body, then all of these that I have ever seen have been simply some kind of mild steel that has simply been painted, as such they rust!

Phil

 

[trevskoda]

Stainless against steel is a big mistake. The stainless has a galvanic reaction with the steel if it gets wet or damp. I was horrified when cutting into my plaxton cheetah. The stainless was fine, but the steel touching it crumbled in my hand.

It has to be 316 marine grade

 

[trevskoda]

I believe that the cab unit on Dave's Fiat MoHo will be attached to an ALKO fully galvanised extension chassis, the problem is then with regards to anything that is attached to it and if it is metal then that is very likely to be some kind of low grade mild steel.

Oh so sadly it is the very same with all the panel vans made at either the Sevel factory or the Renault factory. As we all know these bodies are fully dip galvanised but then anything that is attached to them such as exhaus hangers, spring hangers, you name it, from what I have seen that isn't part of the unitary construction of the body, then all of these that I have ever seen have been simply some kind of mild steel that has simply been painted, as such they rust!

Phil

There not dipped, its a electro plate which is not molten, bit like chroming.

 

[Millie Master]

There not dipped, its a electro plate which is not molten, bit like chroming.

Well all I know Trev is that it seems to work.

 

[Phantom]

The one major matter of critical safety is the load bearing snap break/strength of any straps that are securing any garage mounted motorbike or scooter in place as well as of course the tie down points that of course MUST be attached to the chassis when talking about coachbuilt motorhomes and suitably load bearing points when discussing a PVC.

Over the years I have seen some ludicrously weak, madly dangerous tie down installations using things like weak/cheap bungi straps attached to hooks that have just been screwed into a piece of wood!

Phil

Our garage floor is aluminium checker plate over ply-board, not most ideal but kind of does the job for bolt through tie downs with big washers underneath.

 

[Phantom]

Example and a supplier of the rail - https://www.johnadamssupplies.co.uk/shop/unwin-rail/unwin-surface-rail/
This can be fitted to the floor or to the sides, and you can get accessories such as cargo rings to position anywhere in the rail, so put them right where you need them!
I use this system in my Camper to secure the water carriers in place but it is available in the whole length of the "garage" under the bed to tie anything down.

We have some fitted in our moho garage but would not trust them for anything more than just bungee attachments, as only held on by wood screws. Also the screw in track loops can loosen dependant upon angle of attachment.

 

[wildebus]

We have some fitted in our moho garage but would not trust them for anything more than just bungee attachments, as only held on by wood screws. Also the screw in track loops can loosen dependant upon angle of attachment.

If they are fitted badly, anything can fail. If the rails are fitted correctly you could hang the van off the load rings.

 

[Squiffy]

For the MOT we always remove our scooter from the moho garage just to avoid any potential hassle. But guess that an MOT tester would never look in there or even weigh the back axle?
It all sounds a bit desperate if their argument is that you are carrying goods in what they have classed as a private goods vehicle! It's all gone quiet so guess it was maybe a non-issue really? But agree that the vague definitions would not stand up. A great topic well worth standing up for.

Just as aside to the above comment, most modern if not all MOT station rolling roads now weigh the vehicle axle weights automatically for brake weight purposes, this has been so for a few years. I am not sure if these weights are officially sent to the DVLA on recording MOT pass or failure tests but certainly could be used in the future to be used as an over axle weight issue. I know this because last time I had an mot for the van he advised me that my vehicle was 3610kg, which surprised me as previously I had weighed it at a public weigh bridge fully loaded, including full water and fuel tank for a trip to France and it had come in at 3475kg, after he told me that I immediately went round to the local weigh bridge and had it weighed again it came out at 3336kg upon which I returned to the mot station and showed him the the weight sheet, some weeks later I had another bike mot and he told me he had the Rolling brake tester re calibrated for weight, so be warned although it is not shown officially on an MoT fail/pass your vehicle is infact weighed. Phil

 

[Millie Master]

So be warned although it is not shown officially on an MoT fail/pass your vehicle is infact weighed. Phil

Even if their equipment is faulty and showing the wrong figures!

 

[Nabsim]

I have had 3 mots since buying my van and never once had any info on weight or been advised of any weight issues. Is this data supposed to be shown on anything the owner gets?

 

[Squiffy]

I have had 3 mots since buying my van and never once had any info on weight or been advised of any weight issues. Is this data supposed to be shown on anything the owner gets?

No, it's at this present point in time just used to check the brake percentage against the axle weight, you do not see this shown on anything that is given to you. I only know about it because the MoT station I use was the station I used to own, I sold it in the year 2000 to the present owner who has become a personal friend over the years, he was warning me as it showed at the time all be it wrong that my vehicle was over its mass laden weight and he felt he should tell me. Phil

 

[SquirrellCook]

With the company I use for MOT's their brake tester is connected to the DVSA and they are never sure of a pass until they receive the results back.
When I used to go to a ministry testing station I was advised to have as much weight on as possible as it increases the accuracy of the tester.
As for measured weights on a brake tester you can't combine the weights to get the overall weight. Pythagoras involves his wicked self. The length and angle of the vehicle will change the axle weight.