Smug or what?

Red Dwarf

Forum Member
I shouldn’t be smug really, just can’t help it...

My bro bought a brand new pv motorhome last month. It cost him pennies short of £60k. It’s a British built conversion on a Ducato base. He’s been promising himself a van for a long time and certainly doesn’t have the skills to build. I was genuinely pleased that he’d taken the step at last joining the ranks of all those who enjoy the road and van life.

The little touch screen electronic panel that controls everything in the hab packed up, meaning no hot water, no fridge, no bog flush, no cooker ignighter, no water pump, no lights...you get the idea. This got replaced after much phaffing around, he’s now so confident in its reliability he’s carrying battery lights, matches, jerrycans of water etc.
The whale water heater is mounted under a couch/sliding bed frame. The unit has been mounted just too high, so, when you slide out the steel bed frame it whacks the push fit hot outlet pipe union on the top of the water heater. After a few few whacks it all came apart, now no hot water...
Interestingly the 5hing that most annoys him about the van is that the reversing camera has been mounted directly above the high mount stop lamp. As it’s an automatic van, his foot is generally on the brake pedal when creeping backwards, the stop lamp blinds the camera....
There are a handful of other smaller problems too.

I have to say the quality of the build is crap, stretched pipes and cables, many not properly secured etc. My thrown together self bodge £6.5k van is so much better. As he was showing me around his new toy he was telling me of all the problems, but at the same time extolling all its virtues as a way of compensating. So, for £60k you can be proud of your LED reading lights on tracks and the, er, um, nothing else.

Am I being a bit of a git, or am I allowed a bit of self build smugness?
 

wildebus

Forum Member
I shouldn’t be smug really, just can’t help it...

My bro bought a brand new pv motorhome last month. It cost him pennies short of £60k. It’s a British built conversion on a Ducato base. He’s been promising himself a van for a long time and certainly doesn’t have the skills to build. I was genuinely pleased that he’d taken the step at last joining the ranks of all those who enjoy the road and van life.

The little touch screen electronic panel that controls everything in the hab packed up, meaning no hot water, no fridge, no bog flush, no cooker ignighter, no water pump, no lights...you get the idea. This got replaced after much phaffing around, he’s now so confident in its reliability he’s carrying battery lights, matches, jerrycans of water etc.
The whale water heater is mounted under a couch/sliding bed frame. The unit has been mounted just too high, so, when you slide out the steel bed frame it whacks the push fit hot outlet pipe union on the top of the water heater. After a few few whacks it all came apart, now no hot water...
Interestingly the 5hing that most annoys him about the van is that the reversing camera has been mounted directly above the high mount stop lamp. As it’s an automatic van, his foot is generally on the brake pedal when creeping backwards, the stop lamp blinds the camera....
There are a handful of other smaller problems too.

I have to say the quality of the build is crap, stretched pipes and cables, many not properly secured etc. My thrown together self bodge £6.5k van is so much better. As he was showing me around his new toy he was telling me of all the problems, but at the same time extolling all its virtues as a way of compensating. So, for £60k you can be proud of your LED reading lights on tracks and the, er, um, nothing else.

Am I being a bit of a git, or am I allowed a bit of self build smugness?
That Dometic "power rail" whatsit is actually very nifty. I was thinking of adding one until I saw the price of the accessories to use with it!

What make is his Motorhome?
 

Red Dwarf

Forum Member
He did his homework before buying and has been both somewhat shocked and disappointed. It’s a high spec van with some quality fittings, just seems thrown together. Another example of the sloppy build was the pleated windscreen blind had sections that hadn’t been threaded through the bottom guide rail/bar. Silly stuff, but quite a few silly problems, makes you wonder about the quality control, well lack of it...
 

voyager

Forum Member
he might have enough grounds to reject the van and get his money back. If more buyers rejected faulty vans then the quality would almost certainly improve as the dealers won't want all the hassle.
 

trevskoda

Forum Member
Yep my self build is miles ahead of many vans i have looked at costing so much more,mine cost 6 grand all in and 2,400 was for a chap to hand make and install two new iner gards at front.
plumbridge c park.jpg
 

SquirrellCook

Forum Member
I shouldn’t be smug really, just can’t help it...

My bro bought a brand new pv motorhome last month. It cost him pennies short of £60k. It’s a British built conversion on a Ducato base. He’s been promising himself a van for a long time and certainly doesn’t have the skills to build. I was genuinely pleased that he’d taken the step at last joining the ranks of all those who enjoy the road and van life.

The little touch screen electronic panel that controls everything in the hab packed up, meaning no hot water, no fridge, no bog flush, no cooker ignighter, no water pump, no lights...you get the idea. This got replaced after much phaffing around, he’s now so confident in its reliability he’s carrying battery lights, matches, jerrycans of water etc.
The whale water heater is mounted under a couch/sliding bed frame. The unit has been mounted just too high, so, when you slide out the steel bed frame it whacks the push fit hot outlet pipe union on the top of the water heater. After a few few whacks it all came apart, now no hot water...
Interestingly the 5hing that most annoys him about the van is that the reversing camera has been mounted directly above the high mount stop lamp. As it’s an automatic van, his foot is generally on the brake pedal when creeping backwards, the stop lamp blinds the camera....
There are a handful of other smaller problems too.

I have to say the quality of the build is crap, stretched pipes and cables, many not properly secured etc. My thrown together self bodge £6.5k van is so much better. As he was showing me around his new toy he was telling me of all the problems, but at the same time extolling all its virtues as a way of compensating. So, for £60k you can be proud of your LED reading lights on tracks and the, er, um, nothing else.

Am I being a bit of a git, or am I allowed a bit of self build smugness?
I’m disappointed that you didn’t offer to help him build one, that way you could have shared the errors and mistakes. Sickening to spend that kind of money for a low build quality. There are lots of utube posts on how not to construct, with the authors being proud of their shoddy work.
 

Red Dwarf

Forum Member
He did his homework before buying and has been both somewhat shocked and disappointed. It’s a high spec van with some quality fittings, just seems thrown together. Another example of the sloppy build was the pleated windscreen blind had sections that hadn’t been threaded through the bottom guide rail/bar. Silly stuff, but quite a few silly problems, makes you wonder about the quality control, well lack of it...
I’m disappointed that you didn’t offer to help him build one, that way you could have shared the errors and mistakes. Sickening to spend that kind of money for a low build quality. There are lots of utube posts on how not to construct, with the authors being proud of their shoddy work.
Disappointed? My own van is deffo my last build, get my pension next year! As to help, my bro has no diy skills and pretty autistic in character, although good at electronics. He’s in his seventies and I suspect wanted to get on with enjoying his van. The other overriding factor is that he can afford a new van! Living four hundred and twenty miles apart would also be challenging!
My own build is shoddy personified, built from whatever I could lay my hands on. A lot of it made up as I went along, I’m the type of character that dislikes order and symmetry. Most self builders would laugh themselves silly at my lack of any intent towards accuracy.
The odd thing is though, so many folk have said how refreshing it is to see a van that isn’t all grey and grey. My favourite ever conversion is a beat up old van converted by a guy using materials he took out of skips, more comfort and character than you could shake a stick at!
As to my shoddy work, I’m proud of it!
 

wildebus

Forum Member
I am sure you love your van and wouldn't change it :D

I know what you mean about it being your last build. I um'ed and ah'ed about doing another build (done 3 so far), using a low-loader Luton type van, and decided I just could not be arsed with the time it would take, working in the cold and wet on the driveway so bought a 'ready-made' one instead.
 

Red Dwarf

Forum Member
I am sure you love your van and wouldn't change it :D

I know what you mean about it being your last build. I um'ed and ah'ed about doing another build (done 3 so far), using a low-loader Luton type van, and decided I just could not be arsed with the time it would take, working in the cold and wet on the driveway so bought a 'ready-made' one instead.
Absolutely, over the years I’ve done four. The previous three were VWs, this is my first big one and basically decided that it would have a fitted king size bed, the rest of it is just the necessary propaganda! I couldn’t be arsed with this van, so went for a simple quick rough build..... two years later it’s still no quite there, though very nearly! If I’d got my finger out I could’ve built a copy of the coronation coach in that time, that can’t be arsed thing again I guess....
 

Millie Master

Forum Member
he might have enough grounds to reject the van and get his money back. If more buyers rejected faulty vans then the quality would almost certainly improve as the dealers won't want all the hassle.

I 100% agree @voyager

The manufacturers are bad enough for allowing shoddy workmanship leave their (UK factories) passing the buck onto their mostly woefully dreadful dealers of which arguably about the worst is Brownhills!

Oh so sadly it would appear from watching the various forums and facebook groups it would appear that the Hymer Group vans are about the best for build quality with Adria quite closely following, but then way down in the depths of customer complaints come some of the UK brands.

As for rejecting vans, a near neighbour bought a Swift Group Ducato cab - ALKO chassis flimsy in 2018. Shortly after buying it he went over to France for a long touring holiday and arrived at his first site close to Abbeville which was supposed to be a 2 night stop which turned out to somewhat over a month as the electrics partly burnt out and the plumbing fell apart! After the damage had all been repaired he headed further south and arrived in the Dordogne only for various other major problems...........

Roll on to the present time, his van has been at Bownhills now for over a year, he has now rejected it and he is in the course of taking legal action and you won't believe it, but to keep up the warranty, and before he rejected the van he instructed them to do the annual service following which they advised him that the leisure battery was now stuffed and due to lack of maintenance it wasn't covered by the guarantee!! How could the owner have maintained it if he didn't even have his £75k van to keep at home and use?!
 

Red Dwarf

Forum Member
It really is shameful in this day and age that some builders appear to have system of quality control.

I forgot to mention. after using the swivel on the front passenger seat and returning it to the forward position, the van wouldn’t start. The sensor cable has pulled itself apart as the loom hadn’t been correctly extended. The van is full of only barely long enough cables and pipes...
 

Nabsim

Forum Member
It is expectations as well, if you buy a used van at circa £20 k and have a few problems you just sort it out and get on with life. If you have spent £ 60 k upwards on a new one i would expect perfection, in fact any amount on anything new I would expect perfection unless i knew about imperfections and price reflected it
 

wildebus

Forum Member
Sometimes I think it makes sense, rather than getting brand new, to buy something that is a couple of years old and owned by a right picky bugger who has had it out with the dealers on any issues and so you are buying a sorted van without issues and can just enjoy it.
The fact that you have likely saved money into the bargain is just icing on the cake!

(I know someone who bought a nearly new Autosleeper PVC and because of his personality spent ages eliminating every last rattle and squeak and polished the paintwork to a mirror-finish. Be great to get a vehicle FROM him, but I would hate to sell him anything!)
 

Millie Master

Forum Member
(I know someone who bought a nearly new Autosleeper PVC and because of his personality spent ages eliminating every last rattle and squeak and polished the paintwork to a mirror-finish. Be great to get a vehicle FROM him, but I would hate to sell him anything!)

The problem is these days is IMHO that people have become accustomed to accepting substandard service or workmanship.

It is bad enough that the motorhome and campervan manufacturers (sadly those that are predominantly UK based) have such appalling production and quality control standards. [If they were car manufacturers they would have been drummed out of business long ago.]
All of these companies should have utterly rigorous, fail safe production and QC standards that should remove the vast majority of production problems, but they don't, and then, when they pass their substandard products onto their dealerships, they should employ suitably capable, proud, customer caring people who should definitely pick up the very vast majority of manufacturing defects.......... but no, in this day and age, that would be asking and expecting far, far too much.

Then, when any customer has any significant problems on their travelling gin palaces, surely to God after spending so much of their hard earned, wouldn't you think that in these days of litigation that the dealers would have learned their lesson, but no, the end customers might have to resort to what will become a lengthy and costly legal battle to get what is surely their legal right?

As I have written before, before doing my build I looked at quite literally hundreds of professionally built PVC's and Flimsy's and in almost all instances when looking at UK built vans, they looked amazing until you started to look underneath the chintz and then boy oh boy the amount of bodgerie was nothing short of disgusting................ However, much to my dismay, I seldom saw this on vans made in mainland Europe!

I am sorry to go on about this in the way I do, but you may gather it is a subject which I have held very closely to my heart and have done so for more than 50 years in industry which is why I have been behind several lengthy court battles which in each and every case, my side has won!

Phil
 
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Debs

Forum Member
Disappointed? My own van is deffo my last build, get my pension next year! As to help, my bro has no diy skills and pretty autistic in character, although good at electronics. He’s in his seventies and I suspect wanted to get on with enjoying his van. The other overriding factor is that he can afford a new van! Living four hundred and twenty miles apart would also be challenging!
My own build is shoddy personified, built from whatever I could lay my hands on. A lot of it made up as I went along, I’m the type of character that dislikes order and symmetry. Most self builders would laugh themselves silly at my lack of any intent towards accuracy.
The odd thing is though, so many folk have said how refreshing it is to see a van that isn’t all grey and grey. My favourite ever conversion is a beat up old van converted by a guy using materials he took out of skips, more comfort and character than you could shake a stick at!
As to my shoddy work, I’m proud of it!
Last build eh, I said that when I built the Iveco, but the dreaded tin worm changed those "cast in concrete Plans" So in future I will try not to make plans, and just enjoy what I've got. :giggle:😈
 

Red Dwarf

Forum Member
A quick update. Due to the continuous liquid sunshine I’ve not got much done. Cooker and gas pipe fitted along with sorting the wiring for the bedroom speakers. Some electrical circuits tested, Battery breather pipes fitted. That’s about the lot. More to follow soon, hopefully!
 

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