DIY woodworking maths advice needed

[whitevanwoman]

I want to make a very simple unit to house the sink I got from Doodles.

The sink is 45cm in diameter (assuming that diameter is a line from one side of the sink to the other going through the centre point - I failed maths o leve 3 times so this isn't my strong point).

What I want to do is make a simple wooden square frame out of wooden baton which is 2" x 1". I have some right angle corner brackets which are about 2 " long with 2 screw holes in them on each edge.

So can someone please help with the calculations - I assume that I will need 2 sides of the square to be slightly shorter than the other 2 which will need to be 45cm long.

I won't be plumbing the sink in initially, so for the moment I just want to be able to literally drop the sink into the frame so that the lip of the sink rests on the wooden frame.

I will also then need to mount the frame on legs but will only need 2 legs for the front as the back of the wooden frame can be fixed to the ply (I've got the proper screw fittings which expand behind the ply).

Until I've finalised decisions on water storage, waste outlet etc, I don't want to do anything to permanent and I also want the unit to be fairly quick and easy to remove hence my very basic idea for the moment. Eventually I'll box it in and fit a door etc so that the space under the sink can be used for storage either for water or waste or other. But I find that my decisions about van layout are best made after using the van and finding out what works for me and what doesn't.

So please could someone help out with the maths for the top frame and also advise on what height the legs should be.

I think I've got all the materials and equipment I need to do it, so hoping to get it done today. Then I can at least use the sink as a washing up bowl with a bucket underneath for the moment.

 

[jamesmarshall]

I want to make a very simple unit to house the sink I got from Doodles.

The sink is 45cm in diameter (assuming that diameter is a line from one side of the sink to the other going through the centre point - I failed maths o leve 3 times so this isn't my strong point).

What I want to do is make a simple wooden square frame out of wooden baton which is 2" x 1". I have some right angle corner brackets which are about 2 " long with 2 screw holes in them on each edge.

So can someone please help with the calculations - I assume that I will need 2 sides of the square to be slightly shorter than the other 2 which will need to be 45cm long.

I won't be plumbing the sink in initially, so for the moment I just want to be able to literally drop the sink into the frame so that the lip of the sink rests on the wooden frame.

I will also then need to mount the frame on legs but will only need 2 legs for the front as the back of the wooden frame can be fixed to the ply (I've got the proper screw fittings which expand behind the ply).

Until I've finalised decisions on water storage, waste outlet etc, I don't want to do anything to permanent and I also want the unit to be fairly quick and easy to remove hence my very basic idea for the moment. Eventually I'll box it in and fit a door etc so that the space under the sink can be used for storage either for water or waste or other. But I find that my decisions about van layout are best made after using the van and finding out what works for me and what doesn't.

So please could someone help out with the maths for the top frame and also advise on what height the legs should be.

I think I've got all the materials and equipment I need to do it, so hoping to get it done today. Then I can at least use the sink as a washing up bowl with a bucket underneath for the moment.

Is it a stainless steel sink and is it round WVW?
If round I would use a jig saw to cut a circular hole approximately 43cm in diameter in a square piece of marine ply wood and then drop the sink into it. You want the lip of the sink to rest on the ply wood. you could do the same if the sink is square for that matter.

If square use 5cmx2.5cm (2"x1") baton and use the sink as a template with 2.5cm or so of wood protruding from the edges of the sink. You would have two pieces of baton 40cm long and two pieces 50cm long. This would give you a square that your sink would drop into assuming that there is a lip of 2.5cm or more on the sink. if the lip of the sink is smaller you will need to extend the length of the timbers accordingly.
Hope this is helpful

 

[whitevanwoman]

Is it a stainless steel sink and is it round WVW?
If round I would use a jig saw to cut a circular hole approximately 43cm in diameter in a square piece of marine ply wood and then drop the sink into it. You want the lip of the sink to rest on the ply wood. you could do the same if the sink is square for that matter.

If square use 5cmx2.5cm (2"x1") baton and use the sink as a template with 2.5cm or so of wood protruding from the edges of the sink. You would have two pieces of baton 40cm long and two pieces 50cm long. This would give you a square that your sink would drop into assuming that there is a lip of 2.5cm or more on the sink. if the lip of the sink is smaller you will need to extend the length of the timbers accordingly.
Hope this is helpful

Hi James, thanks for the reply, it is helpful (I think, I'll measure up the bits of baton and cut to size and see how it works before screwing anything together).

Yes it is stainless steel and round. The lip of the sink is about 23 mm (just a very rough measure there, I'll double check), but then there's a bit of a round ridge and then a bit more lip (maybe another 10mm) before it curves down to form the side of the sink.

My jigsaw is knackered (it won't cut straight, it goes off at an angle, have tried new blades and adjusting the angle setting but no good, have had it ages and used it lots and it was only a cheap one so have just accepted it needs replacing) and I got no marine ply and no spare pennies at all for any extra materials at the moment so I'm having to make do with what I've got.

I'll have a rummage in my shed where I've got various bits of broken old furniture but without a jigsaw I won't be able to cut anything which is why I just want to drop the round sink into the square frame (story of my life ha ha!) for the moment as I can add some sort of board to set the sink in on top of the frame once I've got some £££ to get what I need and to replace my jigsaw.

Which is

2x1 baton, quite a few bits of various lengths
right angle brackets
expanding screws for plasterboard etc
hard as nails (in place of wood glue) and impact adhesive
a circular saw (just a small hand sized one)
hammer drill
18v drill driver
various screws, some with a flat button type head, others with a kind of funnel shaped head (sorry, don't know all the various names of stuff and have chucked away packaging)

Not sure if I've understood properly - would I use the 2x1 baton with the 1" side uppermost so that the lip of the sink sits on that? And then the 2" side of the baton would be on the side of the frame and the right angle brackets would fix into that side? If so then the lip of the sink would cover most of the top of the frame.

Also should I use the right angle brackets on the inside or the outside of the square frame? I was planning to use either hard as nails or impact adhesive aswell (belt and braces).

I think I need to use the screws with the round button head for the brackets don't I?

Also will I need to drill pilot holes for the screws into the baton or can I just screw them straight into the baton?

 

[jamesmarshall]

Hi James, thanks for the reply, it is helpful (I think, I'll measure up the bits of baton and cut to size and see how it works before screwing anything together).

Yes it is stainless steel and round. The lip of the sink is about 23 mm (just a very rough measure there, I'll double check), but then there's a bit of a round ridge and then a bit more lip (maybe another 10mm) before it curves down to form the side of the sink.

My jigsaw is knackered (it won't cut straight, it goes off at an angle, have tried new blades and adjusting the angle setting but no good, have had it ages and used it lots and it was only a cheap one so have just accepted it needs replacing) and I got no marine ply and no spare pennies at all for any extra materials at the moment so I'm having to make do with what I've got.

I'll have a rummage in my shed where I've got various bits of broken old furniture but without a jigsaw I won't be able to cut anything which is why I just want to drop the round sink into the square frame (story of my life ha ha!) for the moment as I can add some sort of board to set the sink in on top of the frame once I've got some £££ to get what I need and to replace my jigsaw.

Which is

2x1 baton, quite a few bits of various lengths
right angle brackets
expanding screws for plasterboard etc
hard as nails (in place of wood glue) and impact adhesive
a circular saw (just a small hand sized one)
hammer drill
18v drill driver
various screws, some with a flat button type head, others with a kind of funnel shaped head (sorry, don't know all the various names of stuff and have chucked away packaging)

Not sure if I've understood properly - would I use the 2x1 baton with the 1" side uppermost so that the lip of the sink sits on that? And then the 2" side of the baton would be on the side of the frame and the right angle brackets would fix into that side? If so then the lip of the sink would cover most of the top of the frame.

Also should I use the right angle brackets on the inside or the outside of the square frame? I was planning to use either hard as nails or impact adhesive aswell (belt and braces).

I think I need to use the screws with the round button head for the brackets don't I?

Also will I need to drill pilot holes for the screws into the baton or can I just screw them straight into the baton?

use the 2x1 baton flat with the 2" side face up. I would be inclined to put the brackets on the inside corners so they are hidden. The screws won't be seen and with the application of Hard as Nails you will only need small screws. ready made steel brackets tend to be countersunk so I would use countersunk screws, however as they will not be seen use whatever screws you have to hand.

 

[sean rua]

Depending on how far you have got, WVW, you could make a "template" of the sink outline by laying it face down on some old cardboard ( from a box or whatever) and marking around.
Cut this out to give you a flat shape.
Using this before you cut the main ply may be a help in that you can juggle things around before you commit.
Some sinks have a lip that rests on the ply, and some don't.

If you mess up, you won't be the first; I've got it wrong many times. Luckily, I have so much ply ( from skips or old furniture) that I don't feel it in the pocket.

Other than that, the replies you've already received above are very useful, imo, so, all the best with the project!lane:


sean rua.

 

[ricc]

turn the sink upside down on the floor, lay two bits of batten on the rim of the sink where the front and rear of your square top will be.... then lay two more bits on for the sides it will then be obvious where to cut the battens so they can be fixed together.

when you come to cut a hole in a "worktop " to fit the sink permenantly it doesnt really matter if your jigsaw dont cut straight ..as long as the hole is nearly right the sink rim hides the cut line from sight..... use a large cardboard box to make a template.

 

[hdeagle]

As said before if you lay the sink on the floor and put the batten flat at the front and back. Dont worry about cutting to exact length just yet, then lay a batten flat on top of the others on the left and right, these can still be left too long for now. Now you can screw down through one batten into the other at each corner. Once you have a the square fixed together cut two more pieces of batten , one front one back to drop in between the sides so the four sides are at the same level. The corners that stick out can be trimmed off later when everything is squared up. No brackets needed and you have a double thickness of batten either front / back or sides to give you more to fix to when panelling in later.
Hope this makes sense.

 

[whitevanwoman]

Thank you all for the useful help and advice, it had never occured to me to turn the sink upside down and build the frame onto it - doh! I could have probably done it in an hour this afternoon. Well, that's a good thing learned today.

I'll let you know how I get on.

 

[herbenny]

Thank you all for the useful help and advice, it had never occured to me to turn the sink upside down and build the frame onto it - doh! I could have probably done it in an hour this afternoon. Well, that's a good thing learned today.

I'll let you know how I get on.

Photos when done please Jess .....:dance:

 

[whitevanwoman]

Photos when done please Jess .....:dance:

Will do, plus photos of my new sideways bed :banana:

The bed actually turned out to be far easier and cheaper than I'd ever imagined - I already had 3 x 2ft 11mm ply bed boards, hinged together which rested on top of the sunlounger frame, which I'd been using lengthways in the van but it left no space to move when the bed was down, due to having a wooden frame along one side which is great storage but takes up alot of space..

But the width of the van was 68" and the boards were 72". I had thought about putting some legs on the centre board and supporting each end on the wheel arches and that was my plan.

But then whilst mulling the problem over one evening, I glanced at an old wooden toy box, which I'd picked up through Freegle, I'd gone to collect a gas bottle and they asked if I could use the toy box so I took it thinking if nothing else it would do as firewood. But its a well made solid box so it seemed a shame to burn so I kept it thinking "that'll come in useful some day". And it did as when I measured the height of it, it was the exact height I needed to use it as a support for my bed boards in the van.

So all I've had to do is to trim down the bed boards to a total length of 67" (to allow half inch clearance at each end for when the ply is eventually carpeted), and the boards rest beautifully flat on top of the boxed in wheel arches and toy box.

During the day, the box is moved along the side of the van, alongside the wheel arch box, and at the moment its held in place with a bungee but I will make proper clips to hold it in place and my duvet and pillow is stored inside it (freeing up extra space elsewhere). With cushions on top, I've now got extra seating and the mattress is folded up and makes a comfy back rest for the seat, resting against the side ply, on top of the wheel arch box.

It's worked so well and I'm really pleased, so simple, and with nothing being fitted permanently, it can all be removed from the van easily if necessary.

During the day the bed boards fold up out of the way against the wooden frame on the other side of the van, also held in place by a bungee at the moment, and I'm giving thought to how they can be used during the day as a table top.

It really is like doing a big jigsaw puzzle, and I was buzzing with satisfaction the other night when I'd done it, and had a lie down on it and realised that it really did work

I do love being a short a**e sometimes :raofl:

 

[herbenny]

Its great when a plan comes together.... I cant wait to get stuck into our self build next year !! Cant wait to see the changes you have made and I admire you for having a go .....:banana:

 

[outtolunch]

During the day the bed boards fold up out of the way against the wooden frame on the other side of the van, also held in place by a bungee at the moment, and I'm giving thought to how they can be used during the day as a table top.

there is a desmo table leg and fittings in the shed somewhere you are welcome to have

 

[outtolunch]

there is a desmo table leg and fittings in the shed somewhere you are welcome to have

found all the bits one was hiding in the spare bedroom, its still attached to a piece of skip recovered office desk cut to suit its last use as table/bed base.

 

[whitevanwoman]

found all the bits one was hiding in the spare bedroom, its still attached to a piece of skip recovered office desk cut to suit its last use as table/bed base.

You sound like you're as big a womble and hoarder as me! Thank you.

No Harefest ticket yet, I'll give them a ring next week. Would you be able to bring the various bits along to Harefest?

 

[outtolunch]

You sound like you're as big a womble and hoarder as me! Thank you.

No Harefest ticket yet, I'll give them a ring next week. Would you be able to bring the various bits along to Harefest?

I bet I've got more junk hoarded than you have there is a complete caravan kitchen in the summer house with matching cocktail cabinet and that's without the old VW camper and 7 type car that are taking up the drive I have got to have a serious declutter this year and clear the drive at least.

the bits ( those that are not screwed to anything ) are awaiting in the hallway for the repacking of Berts booze and bedding which had to be moved out after the mouse incident at Christmas so will be packed for Harefest if not before, I saw on the facebook page that the local post office will only accept 6 recorded delivery packages a day from Harefield Hall so I'm not not worried about not having a ticket delivered yet I can see I will be having to pick it up from reception on the day