Poppy
Does anyone know how long would a 110Ah with a 2000w inverter last without being hooked up?
Thank guys
Thank guys
gaz2676
got a stopwatch .......it wont last long probably minutes if you plug a high watt appliance not a good idea running inverters on 1 battery
Poppy
LOL ok thanks quess I won't do that then lol
GRWXJR
2000w @ 230v is 9 Amps... taken from 12v thats 180A draw!
As you can imagine, pulling 180A off a 110A battery means 'oh dear, its flat!'
Ok, that only applies if you had a 2000w draw at the max off the inverter unit - at lower loads it draws less off the battery of course.
As a rough rule of thumb, you are boosting the voltage by a factor of 20 from you van supply to the 'household' type output of an inverter. So if you can find out the consumption if a 'household' type appliance (by looking at the dataplate on the back or bottom and it'll tell you in watts or Amps) you can work out roughly how hungry it'll be off your battery. E.g. a 500w load is 2.5 A, times 20 = 50 Amp battery draw. And so on.
Basically you want to use as little as possible of ANY form of electrical power, so low-draw efficient stuff and using less is the way to go (means your kit takes less space and its lighter and cheaper too).
So... do you REALLY need to invert to 2000w? If you are, often and when off -hook-up, then perhaps a generator is the way to go?
What sort of appliances are you thinking of running in the van?
As you can imagine, pulling 180A off a 110A battery means 'oh dear, its flat!'
Ok, that only applies if you had a 2000w draw at the max off the inverter unit - at lower loads it draws less off the battery of course.
As a rough rule of thumb, you are boosting the voltage by a factor of 20 from you van supply to the 'household' type output of an inverter. So if you can find out the consumption if a 'household' type appliance (by looking at the dataplate on the back or bottom and it'll tell you in watts or Amps) you can work out roughly how hungry it'll be off your battery. E.g. a 500w load is 2.5 A, times 20 = 50 Amp battery draw. And so on.
Basically you want to use as little as possible of ANY form of electrical power, so low-draw efficient stuff and using less is the way to go (means your kit takes less space and its lighter and cheaper too).
So... do you REALLY need to invert to 2000w? If you are, often and when off -hook-up, then perhaps a generator is the way to go?
What sort of appliances are you thinking of running in the van?
Bigpeetee
If you are going to use high power (you wouldn't buy a big inverter if you weren't) use starter type batts as they are designed for huge loads. Leisure batts will soon croak if you hammer them.
I'd suggest at least 220 AH of batts prob 300 AH. Like all electronics, never run them flat out for long, build in an allowance or over head ie, with a 2kw inverter, use a max of 1500w even less if there's electronics, motors etc attached ie microwave!!
After all, you'd never consider running an engine on the red line for prolonged periods would you?? Maybe you would ;-)
Consumer electronics are rarely rated to be hammered, that's why professional stuff is so expensive
I'd suggest at least 220 AH of batts prob 300 AH. Like all electronics, never run them flat out for long, build in an allowance or over head ie, with a 2kw inverter, use a max of 1500w even less if there's electronics, motors etc attached ie microwave!!
After all, you'd never consider running an engine on the red line for prolonged periods would you?? Maybe you would ;-)
Consumer electronics are rarely rated to be hammered, that's why professional stuff is so expensive
Poppy
This is a rough guild & a MAX, as sometimes will be alone.
Laptops x 2
Camera chargers x 2
Phone chargers x 2
Various lights x ??
some sort of entertainment
I'm more than happy to 'rough' it, but my partner like her home comforts, so I need to play it safe (in more ways than one)! And make sure I have enough juice for the pair of us at a one time!
gaz2676
99% of them items can be charged thru 12v ....some inverters aint good for laptops so im led to believe kinda stay clear of the inverter unless emergency thats what mines for ..... otherwise get a quiet genny kinda dear tho .....cheap ones are loud an get on your tits in no time...... hope this all helps
Last edited:
Bigpeetee
All of that stuff you can charge from 12 v without an inverter as such. OK the laptops do use an inverter, but they are specific to charging the laptop and don't waste too much power. Look for 12v laptop chargers on Ebay.
I've fitted a 4 way multiple cigar socket arrangement from my leisure batts for such an occasion.
Even 12v laptop chargers get warm to the touch. Warm = wasted energy ie in efficiencies.
I've monitored laptops and 12v chargers and noticed that mine are more more efficient if they are hooked up to the 12v supply whilst in use, the charger doesn't get so hot as the reduced current is making the inverter more efficient.
Phones need to reduce the voltage to 5v for charging, the smarter 12v chargers use switch mode power supplies that are considerably more efficient that a cheap analogue one.
Look carefully around for all these devices.
If driving, I charge from the cab outlet as that's from the starter batt not the leisure one, esp if you've hammered them with the big inverter!! They need as much juice going into the batts!!
I've fitted a 4 way multiple cigar socket arrangement from my leisure batts for such an occasion.
Even 12v laptop chargers get warm to the touch. Warm = wasted energy ie in efficiencies.
I've monitored laptops and 12v chargers and noticed that mine are more more efficient if they are hooked up to the 12v supply whilst in use, the charger doesn't get so hot as the reduced current is making the inverter more efficient.
Phones need to reduce the voltage to 5v for charging, the smarter 12v chargers use switch mode power supplies that are considerably more efficient that a cheap analogue one.
Look carefully around for all these devices.
If driving, I charge from the cab outlet as that's from the starter batt not the leisure one, esp if you've hammered them with the big inverter!! They need as much juice going into the batts!!
Bigpeetee
PS. When using laptops, go into the power management and reduce background light, stop disks after short in activity, even when on power.etc. All helps to save power.
GRWXJR
Juice use!
Hmm...
My laptop 230v charger input is rated at 1.5A @ 230v (output 19v and 4.74A), so about 30A off a battery if running off an inverter fed by 12v.
So, 2 of those is a hefty 60A for a start.
Camera charges maybe 0.25A each, so 0.5 x 20 = another 10A
Ditto for the phone chargers at a guess, so there's another 10A
Lights? How long is a piece of string as I dunno what lights you have. I know LED's (good idea) were being considered. Note that these should be 12v ones direct off the battery rather than off 230v. As a guess though say 3A.
Entertainment is a wide field too! But as an idea my van's got a 12v DVD player in it that takes 3A, but the 2 screens connected and fed from it may add to that, I don't know. So shall we say 6A as a guideline.
Thats 89A, which is a lot. Having said all that, then chances are if 2 laptops were on then no-one needs the dvd (though you might have a radio on perhaps instead. But 2 laptops on is the hungriest 2 items anyhow - the others are all much smaller. I'd suggest embracing the opportunity to be sociable with one another, and sod the laptops :lol-053: ! I guess though getting away from it all for me for a weekend means sod the damned laptop, but others may well be different.
I'd respectfully suggest that if you were camping off a site without a generator or some other power hook-up to stop you pounding your power store, that you'd want to use rather less juice than 70-odd Amps-ish!
Unless as Bigpeetee suggests, that you slam in lots of storage so you can use more and get enough duration at that higher loading. But its a cascade effect - use more, get more storage, need bigger charger, may take longer to charge, costs more money, needs more room, weighs more.
Its all a compromise between facilities, consumption, run time & cost. Ultimately (whatever set-up you have) the more energy you use, then the faster whatever storage you have gets depleted and needs replenishing. You have to decide on an equipment set-up and consumption compromise that suits you (or your wallet!).
You can tell I've delivered this boring sermon to people installing off-grid domestic power systems a few times can't you :lol-053: Hope this helps!
Hmm...
My laptop 230v charger input is rated at 1.5A @ 230v (output 19v and 4.74A), so about 30A off a battery if running off an inverter fed by 12v.
So, 2 of those is a hefty 60A for a start.
Camera charges maybe 0.25A each, so 0.5 x 20 = another 10A
Ditto for the phone chargers at a guess, so there's another 10A
Lights? How long is a piece of string as I dunno what lights you have. I know LED's (good idea) were being considered. Note that these should be 12v ones direct off the battery rather than off 230v. As a guess though say 3A.
Entertainment is a wide field too! But as an idea my van's got a 12v DVD player in it that takes 3A, but the 2 screens connected and fed from it may add to that, I don't know. So shall we say 6A as a guideline.
Thats 89A, which is a lot. Having said all that, then chances are if 2 laptops were on then no-one needs the dvd (though you might have a radio on perhaps instead. But 2 laptops on is the hungriest 2 items anyhow - the others are all much smaller. I'd suggest embracing the opportunity to be sociable with one another, and sod the laptops :lol-053: ! I guess though getting away from it all for me for a weekend means sod the damned laptop, but others may well be different.
I'd respectfully suggest that if you were camping off a site without a generator or some other power hook-up to stop you pounding your power store, that you'd want to use rather less juice than 70-odd Amps-ish!
Unless as Bigpeetee suggests, that you slam in lots of storage so you can use more and get enough duration at that higher loading. But its a cascade effect - use more, get more storage, need bigger charger, may take longer to charge, costs more money, needs more room, weighs more.
Its all a compromise between facilities, consumption, run time & cost. Ultimately (whatever set-up you have) the more energy you use, then the faster whatever storage you have gets depleted and needs replenishing. You have to decide on an equipment set-up and consumption compromise that suits you (or your wallet!).
You can tell I've delivered this boring sermon to people installing off-grid domestic power systems a few times can't you :lol-053: Hope this helps!
sparrks
For entertainment, I use a 2.1 surround system for a PC running my mp3 player through it, I stripped the sub down, the .1 bit, and removed the 240v lead and transformer and found to my delight that the dc supply to the pcb was 12v. It now runs on a cigar lighter type plug and consumes around 750mA on full volume, which is 0.75A although it's not as loud as car stereos, when I'm in the middle of nowhere I like my peace and quiet so never have the music up loud anyway.
Keeps the load on the battery to the minimum.
Keeps the load on the battery to the minimum.
Last edited by a moderator:
sparrks
Your figures are way over the top.
My largest laptop an 18" screen (19v and 4.7A) takes 8-9A from a 12v-19v inverter. an immediate saving of 21A. I now use a smaller one approx 4.5A Normally charge while driving, battery last 4 hrs
My camera charger I use through a 150W inverter takes around 6A Charge battery once a week around 1000 shots, normally charge while travelling. 1hr week, Will check in the morning
Phone charger micro usb 5v 500mA. 1hr day
Lights around 3.5A all on, normally one or two on.
Entertainment 0.75A If watching dvd I use laptop hd screen.
Fridge seems to vary 4-5.5A 20 mins per hour
Remember a charged laptop uses about a third of the power as it does charging.
nearly forgot, 2 x fans for forced air change on slow speed 0.4A pr 24hrs 9.6AH day
Last edited by a moderator:
Bigpeetee
My 18"Compaq uses a max of 4A from the leisure batts with the 12v to 19v inverter
Fridge, use Gas except when driving
Lights, most time negligable as all LED
sparrks
That was from memory I just calculated it should be about 7.5A, probably forgot I had the fans and light on. My new one is not too bad as it's an i7 core but with an ssd.
Certainly demonstrates as to why not to use an inverter. (240v)
Last edited by a moderator:
GRWXJR
Consumption reduction!!!
I have no experience of the 12 - 19V inverters, but by the look of it they have to be the way to go. I don't have any immediate plans to use a laptop in the van, but if I did I'd be looking for one of these, pronto! I'm guessing Maplins as a source or good old eBay?
I was working on Poppy's question, which I assumed (as the thread was about a 230v inverter) whereby they'd use the standard household chargers via a 12v - 230VAC inverter. So doing the maths then my laptop power supply should use about 30A. As a novice myself and without all the goodies experienced campervanners have, I'd guess its normal to try and use what stuff you already have and know works with them to charge/run your devices.
I guess if there's a solid lesson here it is try to use as little as possible that uses a 230VAC input when away from 230VAC supplies?
I have no experience of the 12 - 19V inverters, but by the look of it they have to be the way to go. I don't have any immediate plans to use a laptop in the van, but if I did I'd be looking for one of these, pronto! I'm guessing Maplins as a source or good old eBay?
I was working on Poppy's question, which I assumed (as the thread was about a 230v inverter) whereby they'd use the standard household chargers via a 12v - 230VAC inverter. So doing the maths then my laptop power supply should use about 30A. As a novice myself and without all the goodies experienced campervanners have, I'd guess its normal to try and use what stuff you already have and know works with them to charge/run your devices.
I guess if there's a solid lesson here it is try to use as little as possible that uses a 230VAC input when away from 230VAC supplies?
sparrks
You did the math for 12v - 240v approx 20x, now try it for 19v much more favourable.
I've always used the Nikkai ones from maplins - looks like they've stopped selling them.
sparrks
2 rules I guess, 1st one above, 2nd one, use as little power as possible
GRWXJR
Power!!!
Ok, I'll give it a bash....
Well, my laptop charger says it uses 1.5A @ 100 - 240V to deliver its output at 19V and 4.74A.
19v is a step-up of 63% on the voltage from nominal 12v, so ......
4.74 / 0.63 = 7.52A (assuming exact voltages and 100% efficiency of a 12v - 19v inverter). So lets say 9A to be on the safe side, or about one-third of the 230VAC power supply to run the same laptop?
As the load is the same, then that can only suggest to me that the 230VAC power supply is VERY inefficient?
Addendum. Working back from the 19v, 4.74A then..... 19v is 12.1 x less than the 230v mains, and .
So... 4.74 / 12.1 = 0.39Amps (say 0.5A to allow for efficiency?) off a 230v supply.
At the 115v end it should need then maybe 1 Amp using the same power supply.
So the dataplate saying it needs 1.5A has to mean its pretty crap then, right?
I realise I could be missing something here, so happy to be corrected
Ok, I'll give it a bash....
Well, my laptop charger says it uses 1.5A @ 100 - 240V to deliver its output at 19V and 4.74A.
19v is a step-up of 63% on the voltage from nominal 12v, so ......
4.74 / 0.63 = 7.52A (assuming exact voltages and 100% efficiency of a 12v - 19v inverter). So lets say 9A to be on the safe side, or about one-third of the 230VAC power supply to run the same laptop?
As the load is the same, then that can only suggest to me that the 230VAC power supply is VERY inefficient?
Addendum. Working back from the 19v, 4.74A then..... 19v is 12.1 x less than the 230v mains, and .
So... 4.74 / 12.1 = 0.39Amps (say 0.5A to allow for efficiency?) off a 230v supply.
At the 115v end it should need then maybe 1 Amp using the same power supply.
So the dataplate saying it needs 1.5A has to mean its pretty crap then, right?
I realise I could be missing something here, so happy to be corrected
Last edited:
Poppy
Poppy
I won't be doing anything like that!! And that's because I wouldn't hav a clue :bow: