Balancing Power Consumption and Charging. Getting there....

Wissel

Full Member
#1
Hey all. For the past few weeks I've been fine-tuning the power and charging in our van. It's a fairly different setup to what I imagine most are currently using, but it's close to being right so I thought I'd post an account for anyone else wanting to do similar.

We use a lot of power. We fulltime and I work online. I don't like using a laptop if it can be helped, I prefer a PC. For years I've been building PC's with a Pico PSU so they run off 12v, but these are unreliable (in my experience).

As self-builders, we all have different needs. Fulltiming, these needs probably change again. Our need wasn't having a van as such, it was making do with a small house and having an epic garden. It was the freedom (financial and location) that van life could provide. We love living in a van, but we love home comforts as well. That means power, for us.

In our last van we had a fairly good electrical system. We had 4 x 100Ah batteries with CTEK charging and a couple of 100w solar panels. This was 6 years ago and that was a lot then. At the time I was berated on some forums for going over the top - hard to believe considering the solar setups that are common now. Even though we only used the van for 3-4 days at a time back then, it wasn't enough. I constantly found myself juggling the power usage, often having to turn the fridge off to use the PC. Worst of all I'd constantly be looking at a Nasa BM1 to see what power we had. Hardly a relaxing break (I have to have PC on or no income).

For this reason we decided to go with LiFePO4 on our current build. We fitted a 400Ah Winston battery, with 123BMS and very clever Votronic charging. It wasn't cheap, but should do the job. We also fitted an extra 2 x 100w solar panel, so had 400w in total.

Then last year, on another forum, I was made aware of how @wildebus had used a 240v fridge in his van and all of the work he had done documenting the power usage. I read the thread and joined WildCamping. That thread alone was worth the sub fee too me. I copied exactly what he had done and it worked great - it was quiet, far cheaper and in my opinion better than any 12v fridge I'd owned in the past. I was and am very happy with my fridge :)

The unexpected bit with my new fridge setup was how useful it was having 240v on tap. I'd always steered away from inverters, believing them to be power drains and not the most suitable power source in a van. I had one (1500w Edecoa), but it was switched on only to use our Tassimo in the morning or if the Missus wanted her hairdryer. After having the fridge running on a small Victron inverter for 6 months, and being able to charge etc without dedicated 12v chargers, we were sold.

The small Victron went and was replaced with a Victron Phoenix Smart 2000VA, which would be left on all the time. This enabled us to do the unthinkable - run most of the van on 240v.

It sounds nuts, but this made running the PC a doddle. I replaced the Pico PSU with a Platinum rated Corsair. The monitor wouldn't need a 19v voltage regulator, the router wouldn't need a 12v regulator, it was easier to start the Tassimo in the morning and far easier to charge our Type-C phones. We still have 12v where useful, but now run most high draw items from the inverter.

The inverter we chose is 92% efficient, so we lose a little power in the conversion, but it doesn't seen any worse than the 12v converters we were running before. It's very efficient in what power it uses itself, with a programmable ECO mode.

The trouble was, with everything running, we used around 75w constantly. Unless we went around the van and switched all the sockets off at night, we would use about 1.8kWh on 24 hours. We have about 4.5kWh of usable power, but I wanted the flexibility of knowing we had 3 days power without any charging. We needed to save power and get this figure below 1.5kWh.

I didn't like the idea of getting up to switch everything off at night and again on in the morning. I like lazy :cool:

Having added home automation to my Dad's house a while back, I was quite familiar with the benefits. So figured I'd try it all in a van.

I went with an Echo Spot as the hub, then added WiFi switches where useful. With the Echo I could add Routines, so multiple tasks could be actioned with a single switch/voice command. The PC was a bit of a head scratcher, but adding a 12v WiFi switch to the power button and setting the Bios to auto power on when powered at plug sorted it.

I now have it set so during the day it's all on. At night, I say a command (or flick a button on phone) and it powers the PC down, then switches everything else off (apart from fridge, Echo, phone chargers and our 4G router (we have a WiFi router as well that takes over if WiFi is available automatically, and switches back to 4G if WiFi lost to save data, but just 4G at night to save power).

In the morning, Alexa switches everything back on at 8am, plus puts the radio on. If we leave the van, a single command puts all into standby. When we return the van auto wakes up. The result - power usage down from 1.8kWh in 24 hours to 1.2-1.5kWh if we spend all day in their. Plus the Echo Spot enables us to check on the dog :D

With power and storage working how we want it, it's now solar we are tuning. 400w isn't enough, but 750w should work well most of the year and will fit. I had hoped to build the array to tilt in winter (with a roof tent under the incline that could be accessed from van), but think it would be too heavy. Sadly it will be a silent genny I think - but only if for some reason we can't drive (60A B2B).

So the search for a system that suits us is almost there, but not quite. I know most reading this will think it ludicrous, but as I said earlier, we all have different needs ;)

Actually our real need is a new van. Ours blew up and isn't cost effective to repair We are parked on my Dad's drive (he's very ill so we would be here most of the time helping out anyway at the moment) living in our dead van while we save up. Still, at least by the time we have the new van, the interior should be built ready, and right, and ready to install.

In two weeks, we will have lived in a van for a year. During this time almost everything that could have gone wrong has. Main thing we have learn't - we love living in a van and both hate the idea of having to move back into a house. Van life is for us without any doubt - we are just getting the bad luck out the way early :D

Hope this was useful to someone,
David
 


#2
Sounds good. I like the sound of the Automation you have put in place :)

Since the original post of mine you read, I also switched (around a year later) from using a small Victron Inverter for the Fridge and a big Edecoa for occasional use to a much larger Victron Inverter for everything to make everything much more 'on demand' as well. Certainly a greater initial cost involved in this, but the convienence factor provided is so much nicer.

Just a thought for you in case you have not considered it (you probably have but just not mentioned in your above post) ... When you have a large inverter such as a 2000W one (or in my case, a 2500W unit), even just the overhead power of it being switched on is much higher than the power use of some of the devices you mention. So having an Alexa Echo Spot and a WiFi Router that both by default run on 240V is tremendously inefficient if that is the only use of the Inverter (inbetween the times the Fridge is running, that is).
I adapted the WiFi Router and Booster to run on 12V (very simple to do as it was a POE type); and I also adapted my Echo Spot to run on 12V (using a Buck-Boost Reg), so the inverter will be default be sleeping >80% of the time (as the only 240V device still active overnight is the Fridge) and only using around 2W during that time, but always ready to wake up automatically if needed.
The only thing I have to manually do with my own setup is flick a switch when I want to use the induction hob (as otherwise it will beep everytime the inverter checks for any demands as it beeps on power-up)
 


#3
So very good to hear from you again David after quite a long absence and sorry to hear about your Dad.

That was an exceptionally interesting read although technically well above what my pathetic little brain could understand!

Although not related to living in a van or indeed anything to do with vans, over the past several years at home I have religiously never ever left anything on standby. I started to do this following per individual item standby checks on power consumption, the results of which quite frankly amazed me when I saw how much items such as the TV were consuming when turned off but still on standby. The result of this is that in total across my house my campaign saw our electrical consumption slashed by approx. £8 per week, or over £400 per annum.

As for the van, what on the earth has gone wrong with it Dave, after all it isn't all that old and you have laboured so much time and effort into making it so perfect for your life full timing? Surely if it is the engine, couldn't you get a replacement engine from a reputable breakers yard with a guaranteed low mileage?

Phil
 

Wissel

Full Member
#4
Just a thought for you in case you have not considered it (you probably have but just not mentioned in your above post) ... When you have a large inverter such as a 2000W one (or in my case, a 2500W unit), even just the overhead power of it being switched on is much higher than the power use of some of the devices you mention. So having an Alexa Echo Spot and a WiFi Router that both by default run on 240V is tremendously inefficient if that is the only use of the Inverter (inbetween the times the Fridge is running, that is).
I adapted the WiFi Router and Booster to run on 12V (very simple to do as it was a POE type); and I also adapted my Echo Spot to run on 12V (using a Buck-Boost Reg), so the inverter will be default be sleeping >80% of the time (as the only 240V device still active overnight is the Fridge) and only using around 2W during that time, but always ready to wake up automatically if needed.
The only thing I have to manually do with my own setup is flick a switch when I want to use the induction hob (as otherwise it will beep everytime the inverter checks for any demands as it beeps on power-up)
I think that's a good idea @wildebus :)

My inverter only uses 8w in zero load, but over say 8 hours at night, this adds up to 64W or around 5Ah. I imagine (but haven't tested) that with a very small load (like the Spot and router), this overhead is on top of the draw, even if in ECO mode? Whereas with your suggestion, I would guess that for 80% of the time when fridge isn't drawing power, the inverter would only be using it's ECO mode draw (0.6w in my case)?

I have a few buck-boosts kicking around anyway ;)

Interesting you run an Echo Spot as well. Do you use any automation?

This was my main reason for installing. Routines, specifically, to do lots at once. I will add the same to most of the 12v when I fit out the next van, as I like the idea of arriving at a spot and giving a single command to setup the van. This could be a summer/on site command for instance, where the step would extend, the awning (electric) extend, the drawers/doors unlatch etc. These will all have relays that sense when engine is running, so can't be tripped accidentally whilst driving etc. I'll do the same for leaving a site and packing the van away. Should eliminate the annoying times in the past where I've started driving and a drawer has shot open :D

So very good to hear from you again David after quite a long absence and sorry to hear about your Dad.

That was an exceptionally interesting read although technically well above what my pathetic little brain could understand!

Although not related to living in a van or indeed anything to do with vans, over the past several years at home I have religiously never ever left anything on standby. I started to do this following per individual item standby checks on power consumption, the results of which quite frankly amazed me when I saw how much items such as the TV were consuming when turned off but still on standby. The result of this is that in total across my house my campaign saw our electrical consumption slashed by approx. £8 per week, or over £400 per annum.

As for the van, what on the earth has gone wrong with it Dave, after all it isn't all that old and you have laboured so much time and effort into making it so perfect for your life full timing? Surely if it is the engine, couldn't you get a replacement engine from a reputable breakers yard with a guaranteed low mileage?

Phil
Thanks Phil.

Your right about standby power draw - especially when it;s a few things, can really add up. What's worse though is if I leave the van for what I think will be 5 mins, so leave the PC, 27" monitor, active speakers (love these in a van lol), etc all on, then don't return for hours. Together, these use a lot of power, which is fine when wanting to use them, but I don't want to waste any. With the automation I can give the command to shut down from anywhere, using my phone. It's surprisingly useful (to us).

Regarding the van, it's been trouble ever since we bought it. To fit a good second-hand engine would cost around £3-4K - about what a 2010 L3H2 is worth. If I thought doing this would give us a few years of fairly trouble free touring, I would do it. But I have a voice in the back of my head saying something else will go wrong on it. I've learn't to listen for that voice :D

So saving up for a low millage, well looked after L3H2 around 2015 and in the mean time building the new interior, using the old van to prototype. Hopefully we will be luckier this time around :)
 
#5
I think that's a good idea @wildebus :)

My inverter only uses 8w in zero load, but over say 8 hours at night, this adds up to 64W or around 5Ah. I imagine (but haven't tested) that with a very small load (like the Spot and router), this overhead is on top of the draw, even if in ECO mode? Whereas with your suggestion, I would guess that for 80% of the time when fridge isn't drawing power, the inverter would only be using it's ECO mode draw (0.6w in my case)?

I have a few buck-boosts kicking around anyway ;)

Interesting you run an Echo Spot as well. Do you use any automation?

This was my main reason for installing. Routines, specifically, to do lots at once. I will add the same to most of the 12v when I fit out the next van, as I like the idea of arriving at a spot and giving a single command to setup the van. This could be a summer/on site command for instance, where the step would extend, the awning (electric) extend, the drawers/doors unlatch etc. These will all have relays that sense when engine is running, so can't be tripped accidentally whilst driving etc. I'll do the same for leaving a site and packing the van away. Should eliminate the annoying times in the past where I've started driving and a drawer has shot open :D
I have the Multiplus 12/3000/16. That is quoted as using 10W with zero-load, and 3W with zero-load in AES (sleep) mode, so if nothing running at all, that is 0.5Ah a hour saving in AES mode (I think AES and ECO are essentially different Victron terms for essentially the same feature).
But if the Eco is plugged into 240V and on, will the inverter still be in zero-load mode? (it is a tiny load yes, but >Zero for sure and needing the Inverter to be active). As soon as the inverter is active and providing 240V output, there is an overhead there and that max rated efficiency of 90% odd goes right out the window when the loads are tiny - that 4W load or whatever will be sucking oh, maybe 40W out the battery.

I don't use any automation at present - I put in the first Echo for entertainment purposes, then decided to get an Echo Spot to give me a little display as well, but I will be playing with automation sometime.

I like the sound of automated drawer catches - please post more on that :D (Just on Sunday I was on the motorway and spotted I forgot to latch the fridge so had to watch out for that until stopping for fuel!).
I bought a couple of those Amazon Button Dot things to link into the Echo - I could put one on the dash as a "lock down" button!
 

Wissel

Full Member
#6
I have the Multiplus 12/3000/16. That is quoted as using 10W with zero-load, and 3W with zero-load in AES (sleep) mode, so if nothing running at all, that is 0.5Ah a hour saving in AES mode (I think AES and ECO are essentially different Victron terms for essentially the same feature).
But if the Eco is plugged into 240V and on, will the inverter still be in zero-load mode? (it is a tiny load yes, but >Zero for sure and needing the Inverter to be active). As soon as the inverter is active and providing 240V output, there is an overhead there and that max rated efficiency of 90% odd goes right out the window when the loads are tiny - that 4W load or whatever will be sucking oh, maybe 40W out the battery.

I don't use any automation at present - I put in the first Echo for entertainment purposes, then decided to get an Echo Spot to give me a little display as well, but I will be playing with automation sometime.

I like the sound of automated drawer catches - please post more on that :D (Just on Sunday I was on the motorway and spotted I forgot to latch the fridge so had to watch out for that until stopping for fuel!).
I bought a couple of those Amazon Button Dot things to link into the Echo - I could put one on the dash as a "lock down" button!
Interesting topic. Whereas I have the new Phoenix Smart 2000VA here, I'm not actually using it at the moment. As I can't move (and wanted to change a few things with my setup) I've connected everything straight to EHU, via a 12v transformer where necessary. I have a watt metre plugged in before to record the draw, then x this figure by my inverters efficiency (92%) to get a rough "expected" draw figure. I then add a little to allow for the unknown.

I guess until I have the whole system installed in next van, I won't know anything for sure as not going to bother until then. I am being very conservative though, so if anything I think my actual usage will be lower.

It will be interesting to see the draw I get on low load, and how it compares to without an inverter. If I follow your suggestion for night use and have the router/Echo off 12v (very likely), I'm unlikely to ever use very small draws like the 4W you mentioned. But I will be at a usual draw of around 60W during the day. I hope that the inverter I have is efficient at this wattage. We will see ;)

Regarding the door catches - cheap car central locking sets :D

Nice and simple, cheap and reliable. I've played with a few ideas like attaching them to shoot bolts behind drawers, with good success. Also work well with a relay and momentary switch to auto lock when engine started.
 
#7
I would suggest you definately check out the Power in vs Power out on the inverter for various loads before settling on a final design. This might cause you to fine-tune your options as the 92% efficiency is only correct for the higher power draws.

You will be disappointed TBH when you check the efficiency with a 60W load unless Victron have done something incredibly clever with a very powerful inverter in the model you have.
This is why when sizing an inverter, too big an inverter is much more inefficent than a 'right-sized' inverter.

When the only load on my Victron 2500W inverter (quoted as 93% efficient) is the Fridge, the efficiency is way lower than 93% as the load is so tiny compared to the inverter capability.
The Victron 12/500 Pheonix Inverter was actually way more suitable than the Multipus 12/3000 in terms of efficiency for driving a 35W Fridge (and if you didn't have to consider the surge, a 120W Inverter would be better again!). It's a bit like having a car with a 12 cylinder engine pootling around town when a 3 cylinder car would have done exactly the same job at a much lower fuel use.

The ideal would still be a pair of Inverters - one as low power as possible for the light loads and one big one for the heavier loads (Which is what both you and myself actually had before upgrading to a single powerful unit. I changed my setup for a very specific set of reasons and accepted the downside of doing so as the benefits to me made it worthwhile, but if the budget allowed, I would consider a VE.Bus small Victron inverter dedicated to Fridge and other low power use)

I just did a screen capture to show the efficiency ...
Power Consumption - Multiplus 12-3000.png

So I have a constant load of around 18W in my van (Wifi Router, Booster, 4G Mifi, USB Sockets, etc).

When the Fridge kicks on, it draws 35W on AC. The Draw on the battery jumps to 73W (so 35W AC out = 55W (73-18) DC in) = Efficiency of around 63% only. But the fridge is using less than 1.5% of the Inverters capacity - a very inefficient use of a big inverter.
If you were to plot a similar comparision for increasing loads, you would see the efficiency climb (when I have my 2kW water heater on, the efficiency increases to just under 80%, and similarly with my Induction Hob set at around 1000W)
 
#8
Regarding the van, it's been trouble ever since we bought it. To fit a good second-hand engine would cost around £3-4K - about what a 2010 L3H2 is worth. If I thought doing this would give us a few years of fairly trouble free touring, I would do it. But I have a voice in the back of my head saying something else will go wrong on it. I've learn't to listen for that voice :D

So saving up for a low millage, well looked after L3H2 around 2015 and in the mean time building the new interior, using the old van to prototype. Hopefully we will be luckier this time around :)
But as a converted van, most especially one which has been converted as superbly as yours has, then the retail price of a converted van is very considerably higher than a bare panel van.

There are quite a few reputable companies around who undertake full engine reconditioning on a part exchange basis and they also offer a service where they undertake all the work for you and then give you a thumping good warranty as well.

I will do a bit of research for you David and send you a private message with my findings.

Possibly if you could advise me exactly what age and engine spec your van/engine is.

TTFN

Phil
 

Wissel

Full Member
#9
So I have a constant load of around 18W in my van (Wifi Router, Booster, 4G Mifi, USB Sockets, etc).

When the Fridge kicks on, it draws 35W on AC. The Draw on the battery jumps to 73W (so 35W AC out = 55W (73-18) DC in) = Efficiency of around 63% only. But the fridge is using less than 1.5% of the Inverters capacity - a very inefficient use of a big inverter.
If you were to plot a similar comparision for increasing loads, you would see the efficiency climb (when I have my 2kW water heater on, the efficiency increases to just under 80%, and similarly with my Induction Hob set at around 1000W)
Thanks for that - especially the graphs :)

Just a thought (probably more a hope), I wonder if the overhead (zero load) quoted for the inverter is present all the time?

If it was then 35W for the fridge on AC, x93% inverter efficiency = 37.5W, plus the inverter overhead (15W in your case in AES) = 52.5W. Add the 18W on DC and the total is 70.5W. Take the DC away again, and the overhead, the efficiency would be 87.5%.

In a way this might make sense. I mean if the inverter uses 15w by itself with no load, I can't see it needing less with a load?

Also, can I ask if the figures you have are purely from the app etc? Asking as just read a post by a Victron employee (about a different model), where he says the power reading isn't very precise. It's here if interested:
https://community.victronenergy.com...1200-inverter-energy-use-watts-reading-h.html

If I had the time today, I'd rewire my BMS and run a few loads and post the results. My BMS has 2 x currency sensors that are quite accurate. One shows the total draw on the battery, the other the total charge. I had to rebuild it as the sensors won't take the 70mm cable needed by the new inverter (and the larger sensors available aren't as accurate). That bit is done:
IMG_20190507_121441.jpg

But not installed yet. I'm busy finishing a van for someone else at the moment, so might be a couple of weeks before I can test my own inverters efficiency :(
 

Wissel

Full Member
#10
But as a converted van, most especially one which has been converted as superbly as yours has, then the retail price of a converted van is very considerably higher than a bare panel van.

There are quite a few reputable companies around who undertake full engine reconditioning on a part exchange basis and they also offer a service where they undertake all the work for you and then give you a thumping good warranty as well.

I will do a bit of research for you David and send you a private message with my findings.

Possibly if you could advise me exactly what age and engine spec your van/engine is.

TTFN

Phil
I'd appreciate that Phil :)

I did do a little research before, but couldn't find an engine that was suitable at a reasonable price. I'd happily spend up to £3k on a proper re-manufactured (complete) engine, but could only find re-manufactured bare units (no injectors/pumps/etc). I also looked at second-hand engines, then started to worry that would just blow up as well.

The trouble is, my knowledge of van engines is woeful. But I do know there are a lot of dodgy engine suppliers :(

This was why I thought - get another van. But fixing mine might be a better option. The turbo is brand new on mine, the clutch has less than 2k miles, new starter, fairly new alternator, the list goes on. I'd basically just had everything done while a new turbo was fitted, then the engine blew after 100 miles (I was warned there was a high chance that when the turbo blew before it would have damaged the big-end. It had).

The details of my van are a 2010 Peugeot Boxer L3H2. Reg number is EF59 UYL.

If you do find anything out I'd really appreciate it. Happy with PM or posted here - might help someone else down the line :)

Cheers, David
 
#11
The details of my van are a 2010 Peugeot Boxer L3H2. Reg number is EF59 UYL.

If you do find anything out I'd really appreciate it. Happy with PM or posted here - might help someone else down the line :)

Cheers, David
Which engine and power is the engine fitted David as there are several different versions?
Phil
 
#12
Thanks for that - especially the graphs :)

Just a thought (probably more a hope), I wonder if the overhead (zero load) quoted for the inverter is present all the time?

If it was then 35W for the fridge on AC, x93% inverter efficiency = 37.5W, plus the inverter overhead (15W in your case in AES) = 52.5W. Add the 18W on DC and the total is 70.5W. Take the DC away again, and the overhead, the efficiency would be 87.5%.


In a way this might make sense. I mean if the inverter uses 15w by itself with no load, I can't see it needing less with a load?
Slight corrections - my Multiplus is 3W in AES mode and 10W in 'live' zero-load mode

Back to post ... a good point you make there. remove the maybe inherent overhead (10W in my case) from the calculation of the efficency and it shows a much different picture in terms of the percentage.

But ... it doesn't actually make any difference to the power consumption out of the battery however, which is the important thing.
So taking the fridge running .... that requires 35W (AC) into it. and I said that means 58W (DC) into the Inverter. (I said 55W in the earlier post, but I forgot about the 3W in AES mode included in that general 18W overhead running 4G Dongles, etc ). Take off 10W zero-load inverter overhead (on this theory that that is a constant overhead) and that would be 72% - BUT ... it doesn't change the point that there is 23W of power 'wasted' to provide 35W of power to the Fridge.
Change that to running an Amazon Echo - 5W tops, but add in the 10W inverter overhead (as the absolute minimum possible which I think we both agree) and even with 100% conversion efficiency, that 5W device is consuming 15W - an overall efficiency of just 33%.


Also, can I ask if the figures you have are purely from the app etc? Asking as just read a post by a Victron employee (about a different model), where he says the power reading isn't very precise. It's here if interested:
https://community.victronenergy.com...1200-inverter-energy-use-watts-reading-h.html
I did some intial cross-checks to confirm numbers but not recently as that was just for intial commisioning.
I poll the system on a 60 second basis. The way the system works is it reads each device in term every 60 seconds and whatever the status is in that split second at the poll-time is used as the data for the entire minute (so sometimes for example I see the fridge using 800W maybe as the inverter data was polled during the in-rush). You can see those spikes in the graph I posted - interestingly they are more apparent in the data logging when the Inverter is woken up by the Fridge kicking on then if the Inverter is already running when the fridge comes on. A curiousity, but not one that I have looked into as no need.

I read the post in the link you posted but I think that guy has an issue with his config and was not a typical situation. I have more faith in the comments of the responders and those tie in with what I have seen myself.
As an example, I can (and have done so as a test) monitor such events as opening the fridge door and see the data in the Venus GX software change prescisely to match i.e. the AC output increase by 6W due to the light on the fridge going on; or turn on known DC devices and monitor the power change (due to the polling system, when the goal is to log this, the 'event' must remain active for a few minutes to eliminate anomolies such as the Fridge spike for accurate analysis - so when I checked my fan power use for example, I left it at each speed for 15 minutes before changing to the next setting)

Going back to that chaps issue - as an aside, but maybe something linked to his issue? SSomething that I found annoying with the Victon app for the VE.Direct inverter was how it showed the usage data as a position on the meter - the power use of the fridge was too small even on the 400W Inverter it didn't register clearly enough to show what was happening (though nothing like exaggerated by a factor of 3 or 4!). a 35W load on a 2500W inverter would really be just noise on that kind of meter they used in the phone app and impossible to see.
 


#13
I'd appreciate that Phil :)

But fixing mine might be a better option. The turbo is brand new on mine, the clutch has less than 2k miles, new starter, fairly new alternator, the list goes on. I'd basically just had everything done while a new turbo was fitted, then the engine blew after 100 miles (I was warned there was a high chance that when the turbo blew before it would have damaged the big-end. It had).

Cheers, David
In all of my many (60) years of tinkering with engines and having a fingers on the pulse contacts with numerous garages, I have never ever heard of a turbo fault resulting in the big ends getting damaged, that honestly is a new one on me!!!
 

Wissel

Full Member
#14
Which engine and power is the engine fitted David as there are several different versions?
Phil
It's a the Ford unit in the Peugeot, the 2.2 HDI 220


In all of my many (60) years of tinkering with engines and having a fingers on the pulse contacts with numerous garages, I have never ever heard of a turbo fault resulting in the big ends getting damaged, that honestly is a new one on me!!!
When the turbo went it sucked out the oil from the engine. When the AA came originally, they said it was a miracle the engine hadn't blown and that it could be damaged.

Then, when getting quotes to have a new turbo, 3 separate garages all warned me (after explaining how the turbo went and how the oil was sucked out) that there was a good chance the engine would be shot and I wouldn't know until a new turbo was fitted. There was no connection between the garages (not even same area), so it sounded true to me :(

Ideally, I'd plum for a proper "remanufactured" engine, rather than a recon. I could only find bare units though, that were remanufactured, at the time I looked. I did just do another quick search and found this on eBay:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PEUGEOT-BOXER-NEW-REMANUFACTURED-UPGRADED-ENGINE-2-2-HDi-EURO-4-2006-2012/292126220631?fits=Car+Make:peugeot|Model:Boxer&epid=9026577530&hash=item4404146157:g:pJ4AAOSwrhBZIux8

If that listing is all true, then I'd happily pay the £2395 (+VAT) price tag as it should be as good as a new engine plus has a 2 year warranty?

Not sure if it's in stock. I did try the same people a while back and at the time they had a brand new bare engine for £1600+Vat or a second-hand unit with 65K on it for the same money. The bare engine doesn't have injectors/pumps/etc and has to be tuned/checked by Peugeot to get the guarantee. This is expensive.

I'm going to email the listing now anyway, to see if the remanufactred unit is available.

Cheers again.
 
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#15
What sort of mileage was on your engine, Dave?
Curious as been browsing some vans for a possible conversion and there were two identical spec vans of the same age from the same seller. One had 100,000 miles, the other 185,000 miles. the 100,000 mile van was something like £2,800 cheaper (near the cost of an replacement fitted engine!). Your situation makes me wonder if it is wise to get the lower miles and pay the extra, or higher miles and put the difference in an "engine fund"?
 

Wissel

Full Member
#16
What sort of mileage was on your engine, Dave?
Curious as been browsing some vans for a possible conversion and there were two identical spec vans of the same age from the same seller. One had 100,000 miles, the other 185,000 miles. the 100,000 mile van was something like £2,800 cheaper (near the cost of an replacement fitted engine!). Your situation makes me wonder if it is wise to get the lower miles and pay the extra, or higher miles and put the difference in an "engine fund"?
Well it "says" 75K :LOL:

I think I bought a bit of a ringer tbh. It was 3 years old to the day and had 35K on the clock (we have had van for 6 years).

During the last 6 years it has had 2x new alternator and 2x new starter motor and 3x new battery. This was all for the same problem. I was new to Cornwall and picked the wrong garage. When the alternator was replaced for the second time (by a good garage, about 3K miles ago), I fitted a new starter motor myself, a good battery and new earth leads. That cured the issue.

The clutch also went at 65K and was replaced so is fairly new, the heater motor went (was fitted the same time as turbo) and I had issues with electrics (lights).

The turbo had a slight whistle for months before it blew. I'd had it checked and assured it was fine. Can you see why I don't like garages much :ROFLMAO:

It is tempting to go for a remanufactured engine. Fitted, I doubt I'd get much change out of 4K, which seems a bit mad in one way, as a 2010 L3 is only worth about £4k, but as I've had so much done (including a turbo with less than 100 miles on it) I think a good as new engine could maybe give us another 5 years with this van. Better the devil and all that :cool:

Your idea is probably worth giving more thought. As long as the gear box etc is fine. Our's also has the peeling paint issue, so if I do get a remanufactured engine I'l have it sprayed as well. Then it "should" be like a new van (y)
 
#17
....
Also, can I ask if the figures you have are purely from the app etc? Asking as just read a post by a Victron employee (about a different model), where he says the power reading isn't very precise. It's here if interested:
https://community.victronenergy.com...1200-inverter-energy-use-watts-reading-h.html
I thought I would just revisit this point as I was finishing off my battery swapover today and thought while I had the tools handy I would do some cross checking :)
I turned on my water heater and according to the Remote Console of the Victron GX System, I was pulling 187A out the battery. According to my clamp meter, I was pulling 184A - so a difference of 3A (36W) on a draw of 2,244W (so a difference of 1.5%).
My clamp meter is not a fancy one and could easily have a variance >1.5% (either way, of course) so I am pretty happy the data getting recorded is as accurate as it needs to be :)
 


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